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The W - Video Games - Best RPG Ever (Page 2)
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darkdragoon
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Since: 26.8.02

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#21 Posted on
Final Fantasy X of course, I think IX is vastly underrated while VII and especially VIII are overrated.

FF Tactics, Front Mission 3, Tactics Ogre if you're more a strategy guy.

Chrono Trigger is a classic, but the FF Chronicles version is SLOOOOW. Same probs with FFs IV-VIs, although they're still quite playable.

Xenogears is great once you get used to it...

I don't consider Zelda an RPG...no more than I would any other action/adventure game.
BoromirMark
Potato korv








Since: 8.5.02
From: Milan-Ann Arbor, MI

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#22 Posted on
Apparently this bears repeating...

5. Final Fantasy V
4. Secret of Mana
3. Chrono Trigger
2. Final Fantasy IV
1(tie). Final Fantasy VI, Seiken Densetsu III (Secret of Mana II)

Honorable mentions, however, go to Illusion of Gaia, Secret of Evermore, the Lunar series, Final Fantasy X, and the Lufia series. Ogre Battle/FFT are NOT RPGs, they are a mix of strategy and RPG. Ogre Battle, however, especially 64, beats out FFT.
astrobstrd
Bockwurst








Since: 13.3.02
From: Loveland, OH

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#23 Posted on
I'd almost forgot about Lufia. I spent over 50 hours in the ancient cave in part 2 and still never beat the damn thing.



"All we are is meat."

-The Deftones
vsp
Andouille








Since: 3.1.02
From: Philly

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#24 Posted on

    Originally posted by ScreamingHeadGuy
    Hey, VSP,

    Being about halfway through the main storyline myself, I haven't had many problems with Morrowind - once in a while it'll crash, but not on a regular basis. (Remember to save! Man, my highschool teacher would be proud of me.)

    As for the cheesy effects a player can create, well, yeah. If that's how you want to play the game, fine, sure. Or you can just play it straight-up and actually enjoy the experience.



I've learned to save after doing just about ANYTHING substantial in Morrowind. It seems like it happens mostly when the game's loading new terrain -- I'll exit a building or cross over into a new area, the game will start loading the new locale and BLAMMO, welcome to desktop. Not all the time, but often enough. I've done all the fixes (dropped resolution and effects down, tinkered with DX 8.1 and the .ini, killed all other processes running, etc.) and still it dies at intervals. Ah well.

As far as "cheesy effects" go... well, the trick is not to abuse the privilege. It's quite possible to enchant some supremely powerful magical toys that completely unbalance the game -- sets of armor that make you 100% undetectable (not just unhittable), charged amulets and rings that spew major rapid-fire death and make melee combat seem trivial, that sort of thing... reducing combat to "see critter, select magic item, click click click, collect loot." No fun there.

If you avoid that temptation, however, the customization is one of the best features of the game. Custom spellmaking actually reinforces character roles, instead of detracting from them -- it allows non-mages to cut powerful spells down to a level they can efficiently use, for instance, leaving the "full-power versions" for those designed to handle them. Spells can be tweaked for different situations; I have ten-second, thirty-second and two-minute versions of Levitate, for instance.

Likewise, enchanting has a great upside when it's not abused. Little things like levitation boots and telekinesis rings are easy and cheap to create, yet they fit perfectly into my rogue's character conception -- he'll float into a room silently, pick the shelves clean from 30 feet away, and vanish to the hideout with the loot in a puff of smoke.

Any RPG with multiple classes can fall prey to a common design trap -- situations that require certain skills to complete them, and only certain classes possess those skills or can use them efficiently. Morrowind's system eliminates that, by allowing any class to create methods (whether by skill, spell or item) of emulating what the other classes can do. A rogue can sneak into a vault as above, looting the place with impunity; a mage can rely on Opening spells to unlock doors and use Invisibility, Chameleon and Calm Humanoid spells to befuddle the guards; a warrior can go with the frontal-assault approach while packing scrolls of Opening to deal with the locks. Rather nifty, that.



"When I feel depressed, I sit under a willow tree by a cool river, and imagine that I am strangling a duck." -- Kotaro Sarai
Jakegnosis
Morcilla








Since: 26.7.02
From: Maine

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#25 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.91
I'm an emulation junkie, and a lot of great games have recently been translated to English in ROM form. Definitely check out Tales of Phantasia from Namco- looks like a FF clone but with a funky action-RPG battle system and more adult content than any other RPG I've ever played. Front Mission from Square is really tight, too, if not for everyone's tastes. It's a mech RPG and it takes some getting used to. Also, be sure to check out FF3 (NOT 3e/6, that's an obvious one and probably my favorite game ever)for the NES. Yes, the NES. I could't believe how amazing that game was for an 8-bit system. It has a job system that's a precusor to FF5. At least download it and give it a couple of hours. I'm also a big fan of Shadowrun for the Genesis, which I like a lot better than the SNES version; the games are totally different, although the SNES version is cool as well. Terranigma, an SNES action RPG from Enix (I think) is really tight, too. For the PS, try Chrono Cross, which I think was underrated, and Vagrant Story, a very technical action-RPG that never got any praise, but which I played the shit out of. It's definitely not for everyone, though.

My top 5 best:

5.FF VII- Great game. Sephiroth is tied with Kefka in my favorite RPG villains list. The materia system is great, too. This would be higher, but I really didn't like Cloud, especially after all the plot twists about halfway through the game. The characters here just seemed a bit weak for a FF game. They weren't insipid, like the characters in X, but there was just something missing here. I didn't want them to die, like the cast in X (well, not Auron, I guess), but I just didn;t really care that much one way or the other. I did like Cid the best in this game.

4.Secret of Mana 2/ Seiken Densetsu 3- Very innovative, amazing graphics for SNES, and a unique story structure where the game is different depending on the three characters you choose to play with. Light on character but great action and long as hell, plus very challenging. The only action RPG that tops it is...

3.The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past- An action RPG, but one of the best games ever and it deserves to be here. Absolutely phenomenal game design. Not even Square can make the nuts and bolts of a game like Nintendo. Just non-stop fun. No character development to speak of, though.

2.FFVI- Classic. Only in second because the characterization isn't all there, and I hate fucking moogles. I think they might have outstretched themselves with the sheer number of characters. Cyan, Kefka and Shadow are great, though.

1.FFVIII- I love the shit out of this game. All the characters are great and the story is involving as all hell. Also my favorite FF battle system. A lot of people are down on this one, but I can't think of anything I didn't like. Even the card game was great, as opposed to that shitty version in IX.

(edited by Jakegnosis on 12.12.02 2315)


Moo hoo ha ha.

Rangers lead the way
BoromirMark
Potato korv








Since: 8.5.02
From: Milan-Ann Arbor, MI

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#26 Posted on
::Smites Jake for daring to break 2 cardinal rules of RPGs - Zelda is an adventure, not an RPG, and FF8 is nothing more than a steaming pile, complete with the WORST battle system ever devised, the most idiotic chars in existance (except for Zell), and the most inane storyline this side of Quest64::

EDIT: ::Also notes that next in the steaming pile category, would be the joke of the FF series, FF7. Sephiroth's no villain, he's a whiny mother's boy whom all the hentai chicks like cuz he has silver hair::

(edited by BoromirMark on 13.12.02 1207)
Bongo P. Michinoku
Italian








Since: 31.8.02
From: VanCan

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#27 Posted on
I'll have to disagree with everything you just said. Zelda is at best a glorified adventure, perhaps an action/RPG if I feel like being generous, and even then I prefer the Secret of Mana series by far. FFVIII has a great battle system for those willing to go deep into it, and those who like something different from the normal, dated Square ATB system. Besides Squall, most of the cast is pretty decent.

Sephiroth is a far, far better villian than Kefka ever was.



What the hell, I'll give this a go.
Vancouver: 17-8-4-0. Just one point behind Dallas, and one ahead of Detroit and Minnesota. West = Tight.
BoromirMark
Potato korv








Since: 8.5.02
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#28 Posted on
.....................I was going to politely answer your post, until the last sentence. You can NOT be serious. Kefkfa is THE villain or villains, when it comes to RPGs. Sephiroth is merely a BASE version of Kefka. Sephiroth doesn't even scrape the BOOTS of Kefka. Christ. You newbie FF'ers.
Ender
Blutwurst








Since: 2.1.02

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#29 Posted on | Instant Rating: 10.00
    Originally posted by BoromirMark
    .....................I was going to politely answer your post, until the last sentence. You can NOT be serious. Kefkfa is THE villain or villains, when it comes to RPGs. Sephiroth is merely a BASE version of Kefka. Sephiroth doesn't even scrape the BOOTS of Kefka. Christ. You newbie FF'ers.


... Along with finding that comment offensive and insulting, I quite disagree with you...

Sephiroth had depth to his evilness. Granted, I don't think he was as EVIL overall as Kefka, but he was more interesting. Sephiroth was, at least, you know, developed a little... while Kefka just kind of, well, stayed the same the whole way through the game.

But anyway... I suppose my favorite RPG is also Morrowind III, though I've kind of given it a rest for the time being as I've started going through Cataclysm for the first time after having it collect dust on my shelf for over a year.

(Edit: Changed 'leat' to 'least')

(edited by Ender on 13.12.02 2359)


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astrobstrd
Bockwurst








Since: 13.3.02
From: Loveland, OH

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#30 Posted on

    Originally posted by BoromirMark
    .....................I was going to politely answer your post, until the last sentence. You can NOT be serious. Kefkfa is THE villain or villains, when it comes to RPGs. Sephiroth is merely a BASE version of Kefka. Sephiroth doesn't even scrape the BOOTS of Kefka. Christ. You newbie FF'ers.


Both Sepheroth and Kefka bow to the evil coolness that is Ghalleon of Lunar: SSS. Nothing they ever said gave me the chills of, "I'm not through with you yet...dragon-boy..."



"All we are is meat."

-The Deftones
Evil Antler God
Potato korv








Since: 10.1.02

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#31 Posted on
I'll go ahead and put in another vote for Suikoden 2, that game just rocked.....even if I did apparently get the worst ending the first time I played it :(



It's like WWE dangling a shiny gold coin in one hand while giving you an enema with the other, which I'm assuming is quite hard to do, but WWE is pulling it off - SKLOKAZOID
Bongo P. Michinoku
Italian








Since: 31.8.02
From: VanCan

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#32 Posted on

    Originally posted by Evil Antler God
    I'll go ahead and put in another vote for Suikoden 2, that game just rocked.....even if I did apparently get the worst ending the first time I played it :(


Never let Nanami whip you around during the Neclord vs. Tinto quest.

Kefka was one of the most unoriginal, one-dimensional villians ever. Sephiroth was just... deep.

Pfft, newbie would apply if my first FF was VII. It was actually VI, which is a good game, but it didn't grab me nearly as much as other RPGs, such as many that I listed above (FFVII, Chrono Trigger, Suikoden 2, Star Ocean 2, Phantasy Star IV... each had an X factor that I could never find with FFVI.)



What the hell, I'll give this a go.
Vancouver: 17-8-4-0. Just one point behind Dallas, and one ahead of Detroit and Minnesota. West = Tight.
Scotsman
Cotto








Since: 23.1.02
From: Kingston, ON Canada

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#33 Posted on
Rings of Power for the Sega Genesis.

Almost no-one has played it, and according to the programmers, only about 8 people have actually completed it(Whoo I'm one of them). Seriously, get it now.



Scotsman.
Check out my home on the web; Scotsmanlity! for all your pitiful needs.
MollyFan2K2
Blutwurst








Since: 26.6.02
From: Ware, MA

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#34 Posted on
THIS POST CONTAINS SPOILERS FOR FINAL FANTASY 6 AND 7




    Originally posted by Bongo P. Michinoku[quotemidbr>
    Kefka was one of the most unoriginal, one-dimensional villians ever. Sephiroth was just... deep.




Well, if I remember correctly, Sephiroth was a member of SOLDIER until that fateful mission where he found out about his "mother" and that he was just a creation made to fight. In his deep grief and anger, he decides to destroy the world.

Kefka DOES have some backstory. He was the first human experimented on to make a "magic human soldier", which was a soldier that could actually use magic like Celes. The powers of Espers were artificially infused into him, but seeing as how he was a prototype, nothing was really safe, so all of the experimentation made his mind snap. For some reason the Emperor kept him around because he was such a strong fighter. Kefka's regression of serving the Emperor to disobeying his orders (Doma poisoning) to plotting to take over to finally killing the Emperor outlines his descent into total madness.

Well, he doesn't really DEVELOP per se, but he DOES have a backstory even if it isn't as prominant as Sephiroth.

Throw in another vote from me for Sephiroth, Kefka, and Ghaleon all being super badass. I want to throw in Golbez from FF4 as well, even though he is the Darth Vader villain stereotype up until the end. In the world of FF4 graphics, his battle sprite looked so cool. Plus he turned good at the end, and when you're a kid playing this game you don't want to see the cool badguy die.

Zophar from Lunar 2, on the other hand, was a pretty big disappointment. Even with Ghaleon as his subordinate he was overshadowed by everyone's favorite misguided mage.



A shark on whiskey is mighty risky, a shark on beer is a beer engineer.
vsp
Andouille








Since: 3.1.02
From: Philly

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#35 Posted on
I wasn't that impressed by Kefka OR Sephiroth, frankly. Then again, good villains are hard to come by in RPG-land.

Pleasant surprise: A couple of sites (including EB's) are listing the US version of PS2 Star Ocean 3: Till The End Of Time as a FEBRUARY 2003 release, not late in the year as had previously been hinted at.



"When I feel depressed, I sit under a willow tree by a cool river, and imagine that I am strangling a duck." -- Kotaro Sarai
MollyFan2K2
Blutwurst








Since: 26.6.02
From: Ware, MA

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#36 Posted on
Well then, who would YOU say is a good villain?



A shark on whiskey is mighty risky, a shark on beer is a beer engineer.
Evil Antler God
Potato korv








Since: 10.1.02

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#37 Posted on
Luca Blight



It's like WWE dangling a shiny gold coin in one hand while giving you an enema with the other, which I'm assuming is quite hard to do, but WWE is pulling it off - SKLOKAZOID
MollyFan2K2
Blutwurst








Since: 26.6.02
From: Ware, MA

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#38 Posted on
You'll get no arguement from me about Luca Blight. He was all set in the psycho department and could probably go toe to toe with Kefka, but he wasn't the sharpest knife in the videogame villain drawer. He would be nothing if he ever met up with Ghaleon.



A shark on whiskey is mighty risky, a shark on beer is a beer engineer.
Bongo P. Michinoku
Italian








Since: 31.8.02
From: VanCan

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#39 Posted on

    Originally posted by Evil Antler God
    Luca Blight


Damn right. If you gotta have a villian in the "simply insane" category, Luca is THE MAN. Also, according to Suikosource, he had plenty of backstory, but it might've only been hinted at in the game...



What the hell, I'll give this a go.
Vancouver: 17-8-4-0. Just one point behind Dallas, and one ahead of Detroit and Minnesota. West = Tight.
asteroidboy
Andouille








Since: 22.1.02
From: Texas

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#40 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.95
Okay, why are people always on Kefka's nuts? He just cackled a lot. And sure, that was funny, but there was really no depth to his evil, he was just cartoonishly evil.


    Originally posted by BoromirMark
    .....................I was going to politely answer your post, until the last sentence. You can NOT be serious. Kefkfa is THE villain or villains, when it comes to RPGs. Sephiroth is merely a BASE version of Kefka. Sephiroth doesn't even scrape the BOOTS of Kefka. Christ. You newbie FF'ers.


Sorry... did you just call us newbies? Not to pull age rank, but that's pretty ballsy for a guy born in 1983. I remember buying the first Final Fantasy when you were a ripe old 7 years old, so step off.

(edited by asteroidboy on 18.12.02 1449)


"My brother saw the Undertaker walking through an airport." - Rex
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