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24.4.14 2311
The W - Pro Wrestling - Backlash
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Weevil
Polska kielbasa








Since: 19.3.02
From: Ireland

Since last post: 3033 days
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#1 Posted on
So is Backlash going to be a Smackdown PPV or will both groups provide matches?

If they are going to share the PPVs it will be hard to get a match once both programs are fully developed.
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spf
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: The Las Vegas of Canada

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#2 Posted on
I thought I read on one of the big sites that it was going to be each group sending a couple of matches to the PPV. Say 3 SD matches, 3 Raw matches, a women's title match and a WWF title match for instance.



"You used it to shove your miserable daughter down our throats week in and week out...not anymore!" - Ric Flair gives me hope, Raw 3/18/02

"I thought it was cool how HHH just tossed Jericho out of the ring and made him vanish, possibly into another dimension, at the end of the match." - Dr. Unlikely says the funniest thing I've ever read on Wienerville.

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GodEatGod
Kolbasz








Since: 28.2.02

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#3 Posted on
Plus, having both promotions put matches onto the same PPV gives Vince and Flair an excuse to interact and try to keep the heat on the RAW vs. Smackdown feud. Not that I actually CARE about the feud, mind you, as I personally despise the roster split (in case you hadn't guessed, I don't get Smackdown). So far, though, only thing on the card that would pique my interest is an Eddy/RVD match (and maybe Edge/Angle, if Edge kicks it up a notch. He just hasn't been quite *there* of late, for some reason. And if people find Nash's hair flipping annoying, what about Edge's constant head banging to keep his hair out of his face? Okay, I'm off on a tangent...sorry. :)"

In other words, having both promotions put matches on the PPV is a good thing *smile* :)



"All I ever asked for in life is an unfair advantage." Microchip, Punisher Annual #2
Weevil
Polska kielbasa








Since: 19.3.02
From: Ireland

Since last post: 3033 days
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#4 Posted on
Kidman/Tajiri should be great too if it gets time, but if both sides just send their biggest names will the lower midcarders be pushed off completely?
oldschoolhero
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: nWo Country

Since last post: 1805 days
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#5 Posted on
Not if they're serious about pushing the cruiserweights. *sigh*



Hey Yo.....................I'm DRUNK.
Sean
Cotechino








Since: 26.3.02
From: Mastic, NY

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#6 Posted on

    Originally posted by oldschoolhero
    Not if they're serious about pushing the cruiserweights. *sigh*


What cruiserweights? Chavo Guerrero Jr. is the only cruiser they have that's even worth pushing, what with everyone else either juiced to the point where they can't work or brittle as hell due to long-term injuries and mass roidage. Until they pull their heads out of their asses and actually bring up guys like Jamie Knoble, we'll be treated to * specials like the Kidman/Taijiri borefest from Smackdown.



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Weevil
Polska kielbasa








Since: 19.3.02
From: Ireland

Since last post: 3033 days
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#7 Posted on
Apart from the dumb angle and lack of time i thought that match was quite good. I love the way Kidman's head snaps back when he gets kicked. it makes Tajiri look better than ever.
Travis
Boerewors








Since: 7.3.02
From: Baltimore, MD

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#8 Posted on

    Originally posted by Weevil
    Apart from the dumb angle and lack of time i thought that match was quite good. I love the way Kidman's head snaps back when he gets kicked. it makes Tajiri look better than ever.


the match exposed Tajiri's major flaw: kick, kick, arm drag, handspring elbow, kick, tarantula, kick

every once in a while, when he's feeling frisky, he can do a tornado DDT or some other "other guy does the work" move

Kidman's such a better worker than he is, it's not funny...of course he's now practically made out of glass thanks to the Billy Graham Diet™.

In fact, Tajiri is quite limited for a puro worker, but seeing as his background is mid-nineties Big Japan (ICK) it's not surprising. Why they use him rather than hire on a floater like Orihara or Sano (or even TOGO for god's sake) is beyond me.

(BTW, before you mention him, TAKA's arm is totally torched)



Even lesbians want me.
Randomwrestling:Featuring a Brit, two Mobtowners, a Chowd, a midwesterner and a Mexican girl. What more do you need?
oldschoolhero
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: nWo Country

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#9 Posted on
Uh...huh. Are you guys TRYING to start an argument or something? First off, we've seen ONE three-minute match so far. Second off, Chavo is NOT the only cruiser worth pushing. Jesus, if you tihnk people like Hurricane, Rey, Kidman, Tajiri, Scotty, Funaki, Christian et al are BAD wrestlers, then you really shouldn't watch American wrestling full stop.



Hey Yo.....................I'm DRUNK.
Travis
Boerewors








Since: 7.3.02
From: Baltimore, MD

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#10 Posted on

    Originally posted by oldschoolhero
    Uh...huh. Are you guys TRYING to start an argument or something? First off, we've seen ONE three-minute match so far. Second off, Chavo is NOT the only cruiser worth pushing. Jesus, if you tihnk people like Hurricane, Rey, Kidman, Tajiri, Scotty, Funaki, Christian et al are BAD wrestlers, then you really shouldn't watch American wrestling full stop.


Point by point:
1) Who are "you guys"?
2) No, I'm not trying to start an argument, I'm just pointing out an observation I've made. In the foolish hopes that someone would discuss the concept rather than just shoot it down without backing up the opposing view.
3) I've seen plenty more Tajiri matches than just "ONE", including non-WWF stuff.
4) Rey is practically paper mache these days...though apparently his recent TJ stuff was pretty ok (he was protected in 6-man matches, FWIW)...
5) Scott Taylor is a mediocre worker who is now limited by a severe and chronic injury. One nasty bump and he's Droz Jr.
6) Christian most likely wouldn't be included in the Cruiserweight division. He's busy jobbing in Euro title matches. (Good ones, though.)
7) define for me "full stop", if you could



Even lesbians want me.
Randomwrestling:Featuring a Brit, two Mobtowners, a Chowd, a midwesterner and a Mexican girl. What more do you need?
Weevil
Polska kielbasa








Since: 19.3.02
From: Ireland

Since last post: 3033 days
Last activity: 3033 days
#11 Posted on

    the match exposed Tajiri's major flaw: kick, kick, arm drag, handspring elbow, kick, tarantula, kick

    every once in a while, when he's feeling frisky, he can do a tornado DDT or some other "other guy does the work" move

    In fact, Tajiri is quite limited for a puro worker
    Why they use him rather than hire on a floater like Orihara or Sano (or even TOGO for god's sake) is beyond me)



He hasn't had a decent length match in the WWf yet, so he's bound to get as repetitive as everyone else, but he has also managed to use an octopus,asai moonsault, german suplex, dragon suplex, hurricanrana and some wierd cradle pin.

I have seen some puro tapes and they don't seem to have particularly large movesets. It doesn't stop them having great matches.

i would like to see more of Togo though. if his wwf stuff was any indication, he rules. if nothing else he could show Jeff Hardy the right way to do the whisper in the wind and swanton bomb
oldschoolhero
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: nWo Country

Since last post: 1805 days
Last activity: 1739 days
#12 Posted on
Counterpoint:

1)Scott Taylor, as evidenced by matches against Deano Machino, Chris Jericho and Chris Benoit, can pull out a very, very good match. I'm not sure where you're getting your neck injury information from; from all reports I've read his injury from last year is pretty much fully healed. He wouldn't be the centre of a division, but he'd make a decent player.

2)I would suggest that Christian most likely would find his way into the cruiser division, due to it being the only midcard title on SD and him being in the weight class (albeit in some weird nebulous way where we're never sure of his weight).

3)Tajiri, when called upon, can pull out a Hella good match. Unfortunately, he's had his nuts cut off by the cutesy character they've had him playing over the past year. As he is due to be turning heel, I'd see that as a GOOD thing.

4) The "ONE" I was referring to was specifically Kidman's one match back after apparently being juiced up to bursting point. As far as I could see he looked a Hell of a lot better than he did for much of 2000, so I think it was be unfair-and unwarrented-to term him as being "made of glass".

5)I haven't much of Rey since his last WCW tenure early in 2001, so I can't be a full judge on him. But back in the bigtime with (possibly) the onus being on him as a bigtime cruiserweight star, I would have confidence in him pulling out some of his great performances of old.

I wasn't particularly referring to you there, Travis. But thanks for replying. Blanket statements like "the only cruiser worth pushing is Chavo" REALLY piss me off, especially seeing as we're only one show into this supposed new division.

As an aside, another possible name to add to the list of marketable workrate intensive cruisers would be Rico.



Hey Yo.....................I'm DRUNK.
Sean
Cotechino








Since: 26.3.02
From: Mastic, NY

Since last post: 4304 days
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#13 Posted on

    Originally posted by oldschoolhero
    Counterpoint:

    1)Scott Taylor, as evidenced by matches against Deano Machino, Chris Jericho and Chris Benoit, can pull out a very, very good match. I'm not sure where you're getting your neck injury information from; from all reports I've read his injury from last year is pretty much fully healed. He wouldn't be the centre of a division, but he'd make a decent player.

    2)I would suggest that Christian most likely would find his way into the cruiser division, due to it being the only midcard title on SD and him being in the weight class (albeit in some weird nebulous way where we're never sure of his weight).

    3)Tajiri, when called upon, can pull out a Hella good match. Unfortunately, he's had his nuts cut off by the cutesy character they've had him playing over the past year. As he is due to be turning heel, I'd see that as a GOOD thing.

    4) The "ONE" I was referring to was specifically Kidman's one match back after apparently being juiced up to bursting point. As far as I could see he looked a Hell of a lot better than he did for much of 2000, so I think it was be unfair-and unwarrented-to term him as being "made of glass".

    5)I haven't much of Rey since his last WCW tenure early in 2001, so I can't be a full judge on him. But back in the bigtime with (possibly) the onus being on him as a bigtime cruiserweight star, I would have confidence in him pulling out some of his great performances of old.

    I wasn't particularly referring to you there, Travis. But thanks for replying. Blanket statements like "the only cruiser worth pushing is Chavo" REALLY piss me off, especially seeing as we're only one show into this supposed new division.

    As an aside, another possible name to add to the list of marketable workrate intensive cruisers would be Rico.


1) Scott Taylor is a very mediocre wrestler. Horrible. He had good matches with those guys (good - not very, very good) because those guys are very, very good while Scott is very, very mediocre. I cannot name one good match Scotty's had in which he wasn't being carried by a vastly superior worker. Thus, I can expect that he will be heavily pushed.

2)Christian will not be pushed into the Cruiserweight division, since that would be a depush for him. Besides, he looks so much bigger than the guys they are bringing in, it makes no sense to put him in this division.

3)At this point, I think it's safe to say that the Taijiri myth has finally died. He has a wonderful Asai moonsault, a few nice kicks, and the mist rules, but he can't put a match together that makes me care about him.

4)Kidman looked like crap. If you think that was a good performance, I point you to just about anything he did in WCW pre-2000. He didn't blow anything, but he is just so much slower than he once was.

5)Rey looks like a 5'2" Scott Steiner who can barely walk, and it's a goddamn shame. I'm sure he will look spectacular when he comes back, because crippled, on-his-way-to-wheelchair Rey is still a better worker than most of the shit they currently employ; however, it won't last, and he'll be seeing Dr. Andrews in 6 months tops.

My original point stands - the only cruiser worth pushing _is_ Chavo, so naturally they will team him with Hugh Morrus. Rico is good, but old - I believe he's already 36 years old. Maybe Randy Orton will come up and be stellar, or maybe they will finally bring in AJ Styles, American Dragon, or Spanky. But as it stands now, the failure of the cruiser division is a self-fulfilling prophecy.



Giant Baba is a sexual icon.
oldschoolhero
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: nWo Country

Since last post: 1805 days
Last activity: 1739 days
#14 Posted on
Don't condemn something before it even starts.

Side point: If the Tajiri Myth has died, how long will it take for the Low Ki Myth to die? Watching ECWA Super 8 2001, he stood out as the LEAST rounded of the guys on show (except maybe Tony Kozina).



Hey Yo.....................I'm DRUNK.
The Vile One
Chourico








Since: 3.1.02

Since last post: 4263 days
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#15 Posted on
Oldschoolhero. Not only do I think Scotty is a bad wrestler, I also do not watch American wrestling anymore. So at least I followed suit by your standards.




"It is a strange fate that we suffer so much fear and doubt over so small a thing...such a little thing."
-Boromir
oldschoolhero
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: nWo Country

Since last post: 1805 days
Last activity: 1739 days
#16 Posted on
Well, okay then. Considering some of the guys I listed were widely believed to be among the best on offer in America, I'd my statement was fair.

And good for you-it's better to not watch something rather than tune in just to bitch. If I didn't like it, I wouldn't watch it either.



Hey Yo.....................I'm DRUNK.
Sean
Cotechino








Since: 26.3.02
From: Mastic, NY

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#17 Posted on

    Originally posted by oldschoolhero
    Don't condemn something before it even starts.

    Side point: If the Tajiri Myth has died, how long will it take for the Low Ki Myth to die? Watching ECWA Super 8 2001, he stood out as the LEAST rounded of the guys on show (except maybe Tony Kozina).



Funny, instead of analysis, you will ignore an entire post discussing the strengths and weakenesses of the division in favor of posting a tepid "wait and see" response. The Whiff had TAKA Michinoku and Kaientai*DX to build around during their last cruiser attempt, and they bombed. No one on the current roster is at the level those guys were when they were signed.

I don't know how this turned into a Low-Ki bashing session, but he's quite good for U.S. indy. He's definitely better than Taijiri or Scottie, not as good as Helms, and not in the same league as Chavo. Still, it wouldn't hurt to pick up someone who could actually work in the division. American Dragon, Spanky, or AJ Styles wouldn't hurt either.



Giant Baba is a sexual icon.
TheBucsFan
TheChiefsFan








Since: 2.1.02

Since last post: 28 days
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#18 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.42

    2)Christian will not be pushed into the Cruiserweight division, since that would be a depush for him. Besides, he looks so much bigger than the guys they are bringing in, it makes no sense to put him in this division.


This sums up the hole in just about every "say, let's push the 'cruisers'" argument. It is in virtually every case a step backwards. The WWF pushes all of its guys as "heavyweights." Sure, Spike Dudley's size is mentioned, but because he wrestles a style similar to, say, Steve Austin, it puts Spike in position to pull out and upset like he almost did last year when Austin was heel.

Now, if the WWF were to push Spike as a "cruiserweight," it would be like saying, "Hey, this guys isn't good enough to fight the REAL tough guys, so he goes for these stupid title with all the guys who can't win the real gold." Why would anyone want to adopt that label, rather than have the opportunity to compete for the much more important Intercontinental title, or even the European Title?



Caring is the first step towards disappointment.
Jaguar
Knackwurst








Since: 23.1.02
From: Phoenix, AZ

Since last post: 17 days
Last activity: 17 days
#19 Posted on
Then it's the WWF's fault for not pushing the cruisers to be just as good as the big guys. I mean hey, it works in my mind: Big guy will kill the little guy if he hits him with the power moves, but the little guy is Fast Like Squirrelo, and if he can get his twisty-flippy shit to hit the big guy, he can win too. There's no reason why you can't build up the cruiserweights to match the heavyweights. It's just style vs style, power vs speed. Either one has a chance to win. There's no reason for it not to work, and I don't see why it hasn't been done. If you make your Cruiser champ have the same kind of credibility as your Heavyweight champ then you can run more matches and storylines that people will tune into because they are IMPORTANT. More interest in what happens in the Cruiser scene means more RATINGS.

Or something. What do I know? I'm no millionaire. Hell, I'm not even a wrestler.

-Jag
EastCoastAvenger
Bockwurst








Since: 4.1.02
From: Clearwater, FL

Since last post: 1811 days
Last activity: 89 days
#20 Posted on
"BTW, before you mention him, TAKA's arm is totally torched"

How bad it it? Is it a retiring injury, or something he can heal in about six months? I know he has recurring shoulder problems, but I thought he was out for this stretch because the WWF was in their "no more than ONE non-North American on tv at a time" moods.



"I hate motherfuckers claimin' that they foldin bank
But steady talkin shit in the holding tank
First you wanna step to me
Now your ass screamin for the deputy
They send you to Charlie-Baker-Denver row
Now they runnin up in ya slow
You're gone, used to be the Don Juan
Now your name is just 'Twan
Switch it, snap it, rollin your eyes and neck
You better run a check..."


--From "Check Yo' Self"
by Ice Cube
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