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The W - Current Events & Politics - AP: Clinton WHite House funneled money to Hamas
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Grimis
Scrapple








Since: 11.7.02
From: MD

Since last post: 1178 days
Last activity: 975 days
#1 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.29
I'll await the righteous indigniation from the Clinton supporters, or at least the excuses to somehow blame a Republican

* * * * * * *

FBI secertly sent money to Hamas as Clinton negotiated peace deal



WASHINGTON (AP) - While president Bill Clinton was trying to broker an elusive peace deal between Israelis and Palestinians, the FBI was secretly funnelling money to suspected Hamas figures to see if the militant group would use it for terrorist attacks, according to interviews and court documents.


The counterterrorism operation in 1998 and 1999 was run out of the FBI's Phoenix office in co-operation with Israeli intelligence and was approved by attorney general Janet Reno, FBI officials told The Associated Press.

Several thousand dollars in U.S. money was sent to suspected terror supporters during the operation as the FBI tried to track the flow of cash through terror organizations, the FBI said in a rare acknowledgment of an undercover sting that never resulted in prosecutions.

"This was done in conjunction with permission from the attorney general for an ongoing operation, and Israeli authorities were aware of it," the bureau said.

One of the FBI's key operatives, who has had a falling out with the bureau, provided an account of the operation at a friend's closed immigration court proceeding. The AP obtained and reviewed the court documents.

Arizona businessman Harry Ellen testified he permitted the FBI to bug his home, car and office, allowed his Muslim foundation's activities in the Gaza Strip to be monitored by agents, arranged a peace meeting between top Palestinian activists and gained personal access to Palestinian President Yasser Arafat during more than four years of co-operation with the FBI.

Ellen's FBI handler in the late 1990s was Kenneth Williams, an agent who later became famous for writing a pre-Sept. 11 memo to FBI headquarters warning there were Arab pilots training at U.S. flight schools. The warning went unheeded.

Ellen, a Muslim convert, testified he was taking a trip to the Gaza Strip to bring doctors to the region in summer 1998 when Williams asked him to provide money to a Hamas figure.

Williams wanted "the transfer of American funds to some of the terrorist groups for violent purposes," Ellen testified to the immigration court in a closed June 2001 session.

At the same time, Clinton and his negotiators were trying to reinvigorate stalled Middle East peace talks, an effort that culminated in the Wye Accords in October 1998.

Clinton's national security adviser, Sandy Berger, said in an interview that the White House wasn't informed of the FBI activities. "We were not aware of any such operation," Berger said.

Ellen testified the operation ended abruptly in early 1999 when he and Williams had a series of disagreements over the operation, disputes that began when Ellen angered the FBI by having an affair with a Chinese woman suspected of espionage.

FBI officials said they tried to get Ellen to end the relationship and his work was terminated for failing to follow rules.

Melvin McDonald, the former U.S. attorney in Phoenix who has championed Ellen's cause, said the FBI's abrupt end to the investigation squandered an important intelligence opportunity.

"Harry had been a tremendous resource to the bureau," McDonald said. "We did not have that many people like him with connections like that to the Middle East."

Former Senate Intelligence Committee chairman Dennis DeConcini, another Ellen supporter, said Ellen's work could have greatly assisted the FBI.

"I know some of the wonderful cases and sheer positives the FBI has done. But when it comes to spying and espionage they really screwed up, and I think Harry is one of those cases," the former Arizona senator said.

The Justice Department inspector general is investigating some allegations that came to light in Ellen's case, including that FBI agents in sensitive probes moonlighted at private companies that were using FBI assets or investigative subjects to assist their personal interests.

Ellen, stepson of an air force intelligence officer, had worked for U.S. intelligence since the 1970s as an "asset," a private citizen paid to provide information or conduct specific tasks. His work started in Latin America and also involved China and the Middle East.

Ellen, whose step-grandfather was Jewish, converted to Islam in the 1980s and began helping poor Palestinians.

In 1994, he began assisting the FBI Phoenix office, which had become a hotbed of cases involving terrorism and intelligence because of a large, active Muslim population, the proximity to the U.S. southern border and a large concentration of aerospace companies.

Ellen testified that by 1996 his humanitarian work, monitored by the FBI, had won him unprecedented access to Muslim militants from groups fighting for Palestinian independence, including Hamas.

In a rare meeting Ellen organized, he testified, the major groups created an informal alliance to ensure safe passage to any foreigner providing humanitarian assistance. Ellen was named a spokesman and met Arafat several times.

Ellen also created a foundation named al-Sadaqa to further his work by bringing sewing machines, eyeglasses and other assistance to Palestinians.

Impressed by the extraordinary access, Williams insisted the new foundation be funded in part by the FBI, Ellen testified.

In an interview, he said he agreed to help the FBI "not as a snitch but as a good American."

"I agreed to co-operate with the FBI in the facilitation of the peace process that would lead to an independent Palestinian state, stopping the half-century of violent and oppressive occupation," Ellen said.

"During that period of time I never did anything nor would I co-operate in any way to harm the Palestinian or Israeli people."

He testified that Williams provided him between $3,000 and $5,000 US in the summer of 1998 and instructed him to give it to a Hamas figure named Ismail Abu Shanab, who was killed earlier this year by Israeli forces in retaliation for a Hamas attack.

"He (Williams) said they (the dollars) would be for terrorist activities," Ellen testified. Abu Shanab distributed the money to Palestinian orphanages and health care facilities, he said.

Ellen testified that Williams told him he hoped the transfer would lead to more money exchanges through terror groups but Ellen refused to earmark money for terrorism. He testified he later learned another FBI operative had offered Hamas and Palestinian figures larger amounts for terrorist attacks.

The court testimony shows Ellen allowed his home, office and car in Arizona to be bugged so the FBI could listen, without a warrant, to visiting Palestinians or Americans if they discussed illegal activity.

The FBI said it commonly uses such recordings. "Consensual monitoring does not require a warrant. In cases where the FBI conducts consensual monitoring, the one party is aware he is being recorded," it said.

One of those to visit Ellen in Arizona was Palestinian Gen. Mahmoud Abu Marzouq, an Arafat ally who oversaw Palestinian civil defence. Marzouq became involved with Ellen's foundation and later wrote a letter praising him.

"The United States will, in my opinion, lose a valuable opportunity for communication in the Middle East if Abu Yusef (Ellen's Muslim name) is further restricted from his honourable efforts for the part of the widows, orphans and handicapped and the elderly in Palestine," Marzouq wrote.




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Jaguar
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Since: 23.1.02
From: Phoenix, AZ

Since last post: 107 days
Last activity: 107 days
#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.72
Um, what does this have to do with Clinton? Any Clinton?

Two things here:

1) You titled this thread: AP: Clinton WHite House funneled money to Hamas. Yet, you titled the link that provides the story for this thread: FBI secertly sent money to Hamas as Clinton negotiated peace deal.

So who sent the money here? Are you saying that the Clinton White House did it, or that the FBI did it? (Think carefully here, as the AP says that FBI did it.)

2) What requires righteous indignation? Or to be somehow blamed on a Republican? The fact that a long-term FBI counter-terrorist 'asset' has now been exposed? The fact that it seems that the FBI sting operation never really produced results?


It seems like you didn't even read the report you posted.

-Jag

What the hell is CJAD anyway? Canadian newpaper?



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Nate The Snake
Liverwurst








Since: 9.1.02
From: Wichita, Ks

Since last post: 3657 days
Last activity: 3126 days
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#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.43
So... when a massive intelligence failure enables the 9/11 attacks to go off without a hitch, Bush has nothing to do with it, that's the FBI's fault. (Which, incidentally, I agree with.)

But roll things back a few years, and it's "Clinton White House"?

Wow, who knew the guy could micromanage so effectively, what with the orgies, secret real estate deals and the selling crack to puppies.

Try not to make the double standards quite so obvious, man.



Kansas-born and deeply ashamed
The last living La Parka Marka

"They that can give up essential liberty to gain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin
Grimis
Scrapple








Since: 11.7.02
From: MD

Since last post: 1178 days
Last activity: 975 days
#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.29
It's quite simple: Janet Reno authorized the payments. Clear and simple. I mean, she's a cabinet member for Christ's sake, and a Clinton appointee, with cabinet members doing things referred to as "The Clinton White House" in the vernacular. Plain and simple.

And the righteous indignation? A Clinton appointee authorized money from the US treasury be sent directly to terrorists. You say this is not a bad thing?



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Jaguar
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Since: 23.1.02
From: Phoenix, AZ

Since last post: 107 days
Last activity: 107 days
#5 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.72
Yup. That's exactly what I'm saying.

If we were giving known terrorists thousands of dollars to 'buy puppies for their children' and we only just found out that they were using the money to kill people, THEN I'd be outraged. However, giving money to known terrorists in an effort to unmask the Unknown terrorists isn't that horrible. IMO, it's a fine plan, and it's a shame that it didn't seem to net the results that the FBI and Israeli intelligence were hoping for (at least, it doesn't seem that way from the report).

-Jag



To Make Jeb Feel Better: ;)

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The less I post, the fewer chances I have to look like an ass.
godking
Chourico








Since: 20.10.02
From: Toronto

Since last post: 3814 days
Last activity: 3759 days
#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.23
A Clinton appointee authorized money from the US treasury be sent directly to terrorists. You say this is not a bad thing?

The funny thing about sting operations is that you usually have to give the people you are stinging something they value in order to gain their trust.
MoeGates
Andouille








Since: 6.1.02
From: Brooklyn, NY

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 23 hours
#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.28
Wow Grimis, you could make a fortune writing headlines for the National Inquirer.

Jesus, if Israel was OK with it, wouldn't this clue you as to maybe this is a tactic to fight Hamas, not Clinton's secret love of Terrorism exposed, as you make it sound? None of us are counter-terrorism experts. It's really best to leave the tactics of this stuff to the Pros.



"I'm sorry, I didn't think I was going to talk about 'man on dog' with a United States Senator. It's sort of freaking me out."


Associated Press interview with Senator Rick Santorum (R-PA), 04-07-2003.
Nate The Snake
Liverwurst








Since: 9.1.02
From: Wichita, Ks

Since last post: 3657 days
Last activity: 3126 days
AIM:  
#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.43
    Originally posted by godking
    A Clinton appointee authorized money from the US treasury be sent directly to terrorists. You say this is not a bad thing?

    The funny thing about sting operations is that you usually have to give the people you are stinging something they value in order to gain their trust.


Sounds less like like a sting and more like trolling for potential Huggy Bears in the terrorist community. It isn't a tactic I'd have thought of (these guys ARE supposedly fanatics, after all, the filthy lucre shouldn't hold much interest) but what the hey... the ol' paid informant bit is classic, why not.



Kansas-born and deeply ashamed
The last living La Parka Marka

"They that can give up essential liberty to gain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin
Jaguar
Knackwurst








Since: 23.1.02
From: Phoenix, AZ

Since last post: 107 days
Last activity: 107 days
#9 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.14
Isn't it nice to know how quickly we killed this thread?

-Jag



To Make Jeb Feel Better: ;)

Note to self:

The less I post, the fewer chances I have to look like an ass.
Grimis
Scrapple








Since: 11.7.02
From: MD

Since last post: 1178 days
Last activity: 975 days
#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.29
Good points have been made, but I stick by the fact that if you replace "Clinton" with "Bush" and "Reno" with "Ashcroft" the left would be lighting this board on fire with righteous indignation...



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Since: 15.2.02
From: Dallas

Since last post: 3610 days
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#11 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.95
(deleted by CRZ on 9.10.03 1244)
eviljonhunt81
Pepperoni








Since: 6.1.02
From: not Japan

Since last post: 2896 days
Last activity: 2893 days
#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.56
    Originally posted by Grimis
    Good points have been made, but I stick by the fact that if you replace "Clinton" with "Bush" and "Reno" with "Ashcroft" the left would be lighting this board on fire with righteous indignation...


How is something that hasn't happened a fact? And since when do two wrongs make a right?



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