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18.4.14 0817
The W - Pro Wrestling - Anyone left who's not digging Dave Batista more than Randy Orton right now?
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Kawshen
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Since: 2.1.02
From: Bronx, NY

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#1 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.04
Well, I ask for a few reasons:

1) After Orton won the World Title from Benoit, he hasn't been booked well: Win title, turn face, lose title inside a month, being something of a pseudo-Rock, etc. Also, with all the overbooking Orton's been subject to, I think it hurt him b/c he really doesn't seem all that over.

2) They're doing with Dave Batista right now what they didn't and should have done with Orton, slow burn face turn. I mean, they're booking him well enough that you want Dave to just kill HHH. The fans seem to want it. I also dig how Dave is the "voice of reason" guy instead of the 1 dimensional musclehead with the road map of veins in his shoulder.

At this point, I'd rather see Batista/HHH rather than Orton/HHH at WM21 and I hope I'm not alone in that.

On a somewhat related note: World Champion Edge defending against Chris Benoit would be nice too. :)




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chill
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Since: 18.5.02

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#2 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.35
All I've read on this board for the past three to four months has been just this: people want Batista vs HHH more than HHH vs Orton.

I love how Batista is being handled right now. So far, very good.

There's also really not much more for Orton to do than chase HHH. Another Orton/Edge feud just doesn't do anything, in my opinion. It reeks of "well... hmmm... nope, we've got no ideas what to do with them, so let's just fall back on their old feud from last year."



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Since: 3.1.02
From: Calgary

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#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.30
BATISTA RULES.

Seriously. He's the unsung hero of RAW, and he's come along quite nicely working regularly with Benoit, Jericho, Flair & Triple H.



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Since: 18.6.02
From: North Cacalacky

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#4 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.94
I'm a fan of Randy Orton, but I think it's time to scale back this push. Firstly, he's a lousy face, and was a really good heel, so they need to turn him back. Plus, it just seems like they're pushing the guy SO hard, and I'm afraid that the crowd will REALLY start to resent him if they continue it.

Also, I really think WWE fucked Orton up the night after SummerSlam. When Batista turned (well, that false turn), he was booked as a guy who had the balls to stand up to Triple H. The crowd got behind that. When Orton turned, it was because Evolution treated him like a bitch and now he's mad because his friends don't like him anymore. The fans DON'T seem to be taking to that.



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Captain_12_Pack
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Since: 10.3.03
From: Elmwood, IL

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#5 Posted on
I don't think turning Orton back is a viable option at this point. For one thing, it would reek of desperation, and be the equivalent of them saying "Hoo, boy, did we ever screw this up!", which is something the fed just doesn't seem willing to do. Plus, like it or not, the guy IS over as a face. The crowd is into him and dig what he's doing on a weekly basis.

All that said, yes, I'm digging Batista more than Orton, but that's because this turn's been handled beautifully. Also, Batista's mic skills are fantastic. He does yell a lot, but it's more coherent, thoughtful, and at least somewhat more intelligent than other big men. And, when he is soft-spoken, it seems in character and takes him out of the realm of "generic big muscly guy" and into a world that's all his own.



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mercer
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Since: 17.11.03
From: Aransas Pass TX

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#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.85
I really wish they had handled ortons turn the way they are handling batista's. I don't think Trips vs Davey is going to be as good as Trips vs Cowboy Jr would be at WM, but we'll see won't we.



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Since: 5.3.03
From: TORONTO

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#7 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.98
It's so unfortunate they've got this idea that Orton would be PERFECT to headline WrestleMania, seeing as he's been booked so poorly over the last six months. I still say Orton-HHH WOULD HAVE been great, provided (a) Orton was the heel, and HHH the face dumped by Evolution back in August and (b) they hadn't already headlined a PPV just a few months ago.

That said, I would be extremely supportive of them changing their plans to HHH-Batista at Mania. I just don't see it happening...



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hansen9j
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Since: 7.11.02
From: Riderville, SK

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#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.06
I totally dig Batista more (I've been a mark ever since the Heat before Bad Blood when he drilled Maven in the face when Maven went for a dropkick, powerbombed him, and pinned him with the fans counting along), but I think the upcoming turn will be hurt by the fake turn they just had.



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Since: 7.2.04
From: Canada

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#9 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.26
    Originally posted by Freeway420
    He's the unsung hero of RAW...


Well, if this discussion is to be believed, he's at least somewhat sung.



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Since: 8.6.02
From: Canada

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#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.78
    Originally posted by CANADIAN BULLDOG
    It's so unfortunate they've got this idea that Orton would be PERFECT to headline WrestleMania, seeing as he's been booked so poorly over the last six months. I still say Orton-HHH WOULD HAVE been great, provided (a) Orton was the heel, and HHH the face dumped by Evolution back in August and (b) they hadn't already headlined a PPV just a few months ago.

    That said, I would be extremely supportive of them changing their plans to HHH-Batista at Mania. I just don't see it happening...


It would have been great? But...they did it, and it wasn't.
Building all crazy to Wrestle-effin'-Mania and then having a match that sucked like the one they had would hardly be great.

Batista is the man. People here are saying what I said about Dave long ago. But the key thing to keeping him over is A/ not rushing it, and B/ not letting anyone know his name is "Dave". Cuz there goes the badass persona.

(edited by Hogan's My Dad on 19.12.04 2214)


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Since: 4.1.02

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#11 Posted on | Instant Rating: 2.10
Sticking your nose in the air doesn't make you the Rock. Kick, Wham, RKOing everyone doesn't make you Stone Cold. I just laugh at how sad Randy is right now.

Batista's latest push has been so subtle that I can even forget how much he sucks in the ring.

Yep, I think that is your difference right there.



Freeway
Scrapple








Since: 3.1.02
From: Calgary

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#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.30
Somehow, I find Batista's situation vaguely similar to Benoit's when Benoit entered the WWF. Triple H had DX behind him and Benoit was his "hired muscle" in as much as Triple H gave Benoit & the Radicalz their contracts so Benoit helped out Triple H. A lot. At Trips' behest. Benoit beat a lot of the top guys, sometimes clean, sometimes not. There was always a bit of tension between Benoit & Triple H, possibly stemming from the fact that Benoit made Triple H tap out in his first WWF match. Triple H gradually turned face over the summer of 2000 thanks to the awesome Angle/Steph/HHH love triangle. Anyhoo, on the September 25, 2000 edition of RAW, Triple H cost Benoit a WWF Title match against The Rock. Stephanie was arguing with Kurt Angle & Triple H (who were fueding) and Benoit, still pissed about losing, snapped and headbutted Stephanie. It was the end of the slow burn of frustration on Benoit's part, and was paid off perfectly. They better have something similarly awesome for Batista to do. Maybe he'll headbutt Flair or something.



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Since: 5.3.03
From: TORONTO

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#13 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.98
    Originally posted by Hogan's My Dad
    Building all crazy to Wrestle-effin'-Mania and then having a match that sucked like the one they had would hardly be great.


True enough. "Great" is probably too strong a word when we're talking about "ORTON! ORTON! BAH GAWD, ORTON!!!". Perhaps I meant the match would have been "more anticpated" had they left the issue alone for a while and not had their so-so Unforgiven match.



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darkmatcher
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Since: 12.2.03
From: New York, USA

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#14 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.16
I've always asked myself, "why don't they just give this push to Batista instead?". Mind you, I'm incredibly indifferent to Batista..but that's still not as bad as my reaction to Orton.

I wouldn't care for HHH vs any former member of Evolution as a WM main event, but if I had to choose...it'd easily be Batista.
JoshMann
Andouille








Since: 17.11.03
From: Tallahassee, FL

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#15 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.63
At this point, the best solution may be going Triple Threat again at WrestleMania, mostly to close out the story that they've been telling since about August. With as a bonus, Flair out at ringside doing a "who is he supporting?" angle, and it doesn't necessarily have to be the guy who wins. I'd probably be more interested in that than Orton-HHH its ownself and as much as I'm liking Batista right now, I'm not sure how he holds up one on one in the main event of the biggest show of the year. I'm not saying he can't, I'm just saying he hasn't proven he can yet. Plus, there would be a point in that match, just like last year, where no one would have any clue who was about to win.

Which is one of the two main problems that come with doing that match, namely 1)they did it last year and 2) that in a triple threat, usually there's one person the fans love, one person the fans hate and one person they're indifferent towards, and Orton has been too well protected up until now to expose him to apathy at a WrestleMania only because I suspect that Batista would be more of the fan favorite if they continue to do what they've been doing with him.

But if it's just one guy, it probably should be Orton, since he's more main-event tested than Batista is. And it's not like WrestleMania's tomorrow, so there's tricks they can still pull with his push if they feel they need to turn the babyface meter up on him just a tad more.



(edited by Blanket Jackson on 20.12.04 1346)


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Since: 16.3.04
From: Albuquerque, NM

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#16 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.90
    Originally posted by Kawshen
    Well, I ask for a few reasons:

    1) After Orton won the World Title from Benoit, he hasn't been booked well: Win title, turn face, lose title inside a month, being something of a pseudo-Rock, etc. Also, with all the overbooking Orton's been subject to, I think it hurt him b/c he really doesn't seem all that over.

    2) They're doing with Dave Batista right now what they didn't and should have done with Orton, slow burn face turn. I mean, they're booking him well enough that you want Dave to just kill HHH. The fans seem to want it. I also dig how Dave is the "voice of reason" guy instead of the 1 dimensional musclehead with the road map of veins in his shoulder.

    At this point, I'd rather see Batista/HHH rather than Orton/HHH at WM21 and I hope I'm not alone in that.

    On a somewhat related note: World Champion Edge defending against Chris Benoit would be nice too. :)


I would agree...the Batista thing is a great tease, and one of the best parts of Raw...they really pulled off the faux fight a few weeks ago, and the added attraction of the 6 guys in the elimination chamber is awesome.

I'm going to the Live Event in Abilene between the NYRevolution and Rumble, and the announced main event is a tornado tag cage match between HHH/Edge and Benoit/Orton. Makes me wonder if this will have anything to do with RAW in the Monday before or after the Abilene show.
oldschoolhero
Knackwurst








Since: 2.1.02
From: nWo Country

Since last post: 1799 days
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#17 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.77
"Which is one of the two main problems that come with doing that match, namely 1)they did it last year and 2) that in a triple threat, usually there's one person the fans love, one person the fans hate and one person they're indifferent towards, and Orton has been too well protected up until now to expose him to apathy at a WrestleMania only because I suspect that Batista would be more of the fan favorite if they continue to do what they've been doing with him."

Simple simple simple: Fatal Fourway for the World Heavyweight Title, HHH Vs. Randy Orton Vs. Batista Vs. Ric Flair. You got the already-laid Orton build-up, Batista's superb slow-burn turn and an additional "Flair's last big shot at winning the gold" angle boosting the heat to a whole 'nuther level. Hell, add in Hunter's "There's only ever been one fourway main event at WrestleMania-and I won it!" boasting point. Then you do Orton getting his belt back, and spend the summer period bouncing him off of Batista and Edge, either of whom would be worthy candidates to end his reign at SummerSlam.



Once upon a time in China, some believe, around the year one double-ought three, head priest of the White Lotus Clan, Pai Mei was walking down the road, contemplating whatever it is that a man of Pai Mei's infinite power contemplates - which is another way of saying "who knows" - when a Shaolin monk appeared, traveling in the opposite direction. As the monk and the priest crossed paths, Pai Mei, in a practically unfathomable display of generosity, gave the monk the slightest of nods. The nod was not returned. Now was it the intention of the Shaolin monk to insult Pai Mei or did he just fail to see the generous social gesture? The motives of the monk remain unknown. What is known, are the consequences. The next morning Pai Mei appeared at the Shaolin Temple and demanded of the Temple's head abbot that he offer Pai Mei his neck to repay the insult. The Abbot at first tried to console Pai Mei, only to find Pai Mei was inconsolable. So began the massacre of the Shaolin Temple and all 60 of the monks inside at the fists of the White Lotus. And so began the legend of Pai Mei's five point palm exploding heart technique.
JustinShapiro
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Since: 12.12.01
From: Pittsburgh, PA

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#18 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.68
Give this guy, this OSH, a big check of prize money for good ideas.

Hunter (w/ Stephanie) vs. Orton (w/ Vince), and then Shane-o Mac could unite with Batista as breakdancing buddies and get him in the match, and then Linda McMahon could be like "I feel that there is someone who deserves to also be in the Wrestlemania main event and his name is The Nature Boy, Ric Flair. 'Woo.'" A MCMAHON IN EVERY EVOLUTIONARY CORNER
JayJayDean
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: Seattle, WA

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#19 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.91
I gotta admit, the idea of them redoing the Savage/Elizabeth/Flair angle with Vince/Linda/Flair would probably bring some good stuff, with Flair bringing up "the good ol' days" to Linda and Linda being all like "that was a long time ago" and Vince catching wind of it and Flair cutting promos on Vince about him and Linda and Linda putting Flair in the main event to make Vince even more jealous...well, it's all too good.



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Since: 5.10.02
From: Battle Creek, Michigan

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#20 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.00
    Originally posted by Kawshen
    >On a somewhat related note: World Champion Edge defending against Chris Benoit would be nice too. :)



Ooooh, I pick this. Well, swap Benoit and Edge's positions. But then again I've been bizarrely liking Edge lately and him and Benoit are always great against each-other.

I enjoy Batista for what he is, but I don't see how being entertaining in tag matches that hide his weaknesses, decent in singles matches, and an okayish promo when he doesn't have to say too much = MAIN EVENT STAR. Yeah, the build for his turn has been better than Orton's but that speaks more about how BADLY they've fucked Orton's turn up. I kinda think if they turn Batista it's going to screw up everything that's entertaining about him. The 4-way idea sounds fine, though, as they desperately need something to create interest in the likely WM main-event, because I really really don't care at all about HHH-Orton.



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