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The W - Music - Alanis
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ironcladlou
Potato korv








Since: 2.1.02
From: Quincy, MA

Since last post: 2242 days
Last activity: 2094 days
#1 Posted on


Y'know, I heard the new Alanis Morrissette song, and I tried REALLY FUCKING HARD to hate it. I just can't. I feel so ashamed.



ironcladlou, AKA Cygnet

"I am made from the dust of the stars, and the oceans flow in my veins"


- Rush, 'Presto'

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chuckc14
Summer sausage








Since: 2.1.02
From: Nashville

Since last post: 3157 days
Last activity: 1545 days
#2 Posted on
Don't be ashamed. If it helps, I have a dorky guilty pleasure of my own. I actually like a couple of N Sync songs...What are you snickering at??? I only said A COUPLE!

Tell me I didn't just say that.



"I am disrespectful to dirt! Can't you see that I am serious?" - Mr. Sparkle

(edited by chuckc14 on 14.1.02 0838)
cfgb
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Ottawa, Ontario

Since last post: 15 hours
Last activity: 3 hours
#3 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.87
There is NEVER a good reason to dislike Alanis! EVER!




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ironcladlou
Potato korv








Since: 2.1.02
From: Quincy, MA

Since last post: 2242 days
Last activity: 2094 days
#4 Posted on


The naked video was a good reason. Jagged Little Pill had like 12 good reasons. If there's one thing this world is not in danger of running out of, it's good reasons to dislike Alanis Morrissette.



ironcladlou, AKA Cygnet

"I am made from the dust of the stars, and the oceans flow in my veins"


- Rush, 'Presto'

spf
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: The Las Vegas of Canada

Since last post: 62 days
Last activity: 1 day
AIM:  
#5 Posted on
Nothing wrong with liking Alanis. I think she got more pub and success than was commensurate with her talent (Jagged Little Pill went Diamond) but she was the most easily accessible of the female singer/songwriters (Tori was too complex, Jewel too folky, Bjork too weird, Sarah too earth-mothery, etc.) so there ya go. "Uninvited" was an amazing song though, and when I heard it I was amazed she had something like that in her. The new song I heard for the first time this morning, and I can't say I really like until I hear it a few more times, but I know I don't dislike it.

*edit* heard it a couple more times, and I think it could have legs for me.


There, I feel better now.

(edited by spf2119 on 16.1.02 2117)
cfgb
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Ottawa, Ontario

Since last post: 15 hours
Last activity: 3 hours
#6 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.87
Jagged Little Pill had like 12 good reasons.

I have listened to that CD once a week for about 5 years now and I *still* am not tired of anything on it! It is (in my biased opinion) the best album ever released, hands down.

Nothing I own or have heard comes remotely close.




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Jobberman
Kishke








Since: 2.1.02
From: West Palm Beach, FL

Since last post: 59 days
Last activity: 21 days
#7 Posted on


Anyone know the name of this new Alanis song? I don't listen to radio stations that would ever play it. Curious about how it sounds, though.
Ruby Trax
Summer sausage








Since: 10.12.01
From: The KZiM Tower

Since last post: 2000 days
Last activity: 1317 days
#8 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.25
It's called "Hands Clean" and it sounds like this: zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz



The only thing I enjoy more than doing the crossword puzzle is actually finishing it.
Papercuts!
Potato korv








Since: 3.1.02
From: Springfield, Mo.

Since last post: 4443 days
Last activity: 4353 days
#9 Posted on
Alanis Morrisette is a fake.

She was signed to a multi-record deal in the late 80s/early 90s to a multi-record contract. The first album produced was a pop album, and she was packaged along the lines of Paula Abdul.

The album bombed. Shortly afterward, The "alternative" boom began and her record company opted to repackage her as an "angry" songstress. They teamed her up with Uber-producer Glenn Ballard, who has worked in the past with Aerosmith, helping them churn out and repackage the same song 15 or 16 times over the past ten years or so, with MTV shoving it down our throats (sound familiar?). Anyway, it's pretty well known Ballard is the one who wrote "You Oughtta Know" and most of the other "hit" songs from JLP.

All the while, we got an introspective Alanis, mumbling about how all the songs came from her heart and past experiences, pretending to be a tortured artist.

Interestingly enough, when "YOK" became a hit, most music news outlets began sniffing around for background info on Morrisette. MTV actually found footage of an old video of her, where she was dressed in spandex and a sweatband, dancing around with a fireplug blown behind her. The record company QUICKLY worked to suppress said footage and music from her "prior" career, thus eliminating any contradictory backstory about their "artist."

Shortly afterward, Flea and Dave Navarro, who played on YOK and a couple other JLP tunes (IIRC) went on record, talking about how difficult the recording session was. Of course, that was written off as the then-RHCP members being their "nutty" selves.



Jason Baldwin
Head Writer, 4-Color Review
And the guy behind PAPER CUTS!
TRUTHFUL comic book commentary
Every Thursday, only at 4-Color Review
http://4colorreview.com
Abmulabmu
Cotto








Since: 10.12.01

Since last post: 123 days
Last activity: 15 hours
#10 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.56
HEY KIM FUCK YOU. Alanis is cool. I think she's cool. She's totally cool.





Helen Keller was largely useless, and look how we remember her.
rte66usa
Polska kielbasa








Since: 2.1.02

Since last post: 4601 days
Last activity: 4596 days
#11 Posted on
As far as her being "Fake" goes, who really cares. You try something, it doesn't work, you try something else. Was Ballard on the right track taking Alanis in the direction that produced "Jagged Little Pill"? Obviously so. Did a great record come out of it? Obviously so. Did millions agree? Obviously so.

I don't care if you sell-out, lip-synch, blow your way into a deal, rely on others to write what you can't, have sex with your dog, or wait tables at Denny's. If it ultimately ends up in a song I like, I'm going to like it. Disliking it on the basis of the individual would be like me disliking the Dudley's because when the show is over, they don't really go home to a town called Dudleyville.

It's entertainment. If it's good, count me in.
Ruby Trax
Summer sausage








Since: 10.12.01
From: The KZiM Tower

Since last post: 2000 days
Last activity: 1317 days
#12 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.25
HEY MIKE did I say she was UNcool? No, all I said was ZZZZZZZZZ which is true. Zzzzzzzzz.



The only thing I enjoy more than doing the crossword puzzle is actually finishing it.
spf
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: The Las Vegas of Canada

Since last post: 62 days
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AIM:  
#13 Posted on
Originally posted by rte66usa
I don't care if you sell-out, lip-synch, blow your way into a deal, rely on others to write what you can't, have sex with your dog, or wait tables at Denny's. If it ultimately ends up in a song I like, I'm going to like it. Disliking it on the basis of the individual would be like me disliking the Dudley's because when the show is over, they don't really go home to a town called Dudleyville.

It's entertainment. If it's good, count me in.



Wait a minute. You mean there's no Dudleyville?! Awwww shit dude...that just sucks donkey balls.



There, I feel better now.

(edited by spf2119 on 20.1.02 2358)
Papercuts!
Potato korv








Since: 3.1.02
From: Springfield, Mo.

Since last post: 4443 days
Last activity: 4353 days
#14 Posted on
Originally posted by rte66usa
Did a great record come out of it? Obviously so. Did millions agree? Obviously so.

I don't care if you sell-out, lip-synch, blow your way into a deal, rely on others to write what you can't, have sex with your dog, or wait tables at Denny's. If it ultimately ends up in a song I like, I'm going to like it.



I have to respectfully disagree with you there. There's been a HUGE precedent set in the past with this type of thing.

You're telling me honestly that you had ZERO problem when it was revealed that Milli Vanilli weren't comprised of Rob and Fab? The Grammy committee certainly did when they gave back their Grammys -- one of which they beat Soundgarden for in the "best new artist" category. But a "great record" came of it and "millions" agreed -- making it "okay" by your definition that they literally duped the world.

It's one thing to be an "act" like the Ramones or Marilyn Manson or Alice Cooper or GWAR where you're putting on a show and the audience KNOWS you're not what you "claim" you are -- all the members of The Ramones REALLY didn't share the same last name -- but they go along with it for the sheer entertainment of it all(hence your Dudleyville reference).

It's another to sit across the table from Charlie Rose and tell a bald faced lie about how YOU and YOU ALONE wrote EVERY song on your hit album and how they all came from your personal tortured experiences or that you struggled as an unknown artist performing this honest type of introspective music without a record deal for year.. It's a LIE for a record company to call your second album a debut album. It's deliberate when a record company tries to cover up your past work in order to further an "image" they've tacked onto you because that image currently sells.

Look how everyone treats Vanilla Ice. First, he was a white rapper, who happened to lie heavily about his past. And he was blasted for it. In the mid-90s, when Cypress Hill and other similar acts were all the rage, he came back as a "drug rapper." A few years back, he turned up as an "aggro" artist in the vein of Limp Biscuit. He has ZERO credibility because he a talentless fake. There's no difference in my mind between him and Alanis Morrisette.

On a completely unrelated note, I have to get nostalgic for a moment about Burger Chef, my favorite of the departed fast-food joints. But what about JEFF?



Jason Baldwin
Head Writer, 4-Color Review
And the guy behind PAPER CUTS!
TRUTHFUL comic book commentary
Every Thursday, only at 4-Color Review
http://4colorreview.com

(edited by Papercuts! on 24.1.02 0640)
cfgb
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Ottawa, Ontario

Since last post: 15 hours
Last activity: 3 hours
#15 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.87
Look how everyone treats Vanilla Ice. First, he was a white rapper, who happened to lie heavily about his past. And he was blasted for it. In the mid-90s, when Cypress Hill and other similar acts were all the rage, he came back as a "drug rapper." A few years back, he turned up as an "aggro" artist in the vein of Limp Biscuit. He has ZERO credibility because he a talentless fake. There's no difference in my mind between him and Alanis Morrisette.

EXCEPT that the public backlashed against them according to you - whereas they did not for Alanis.

Alanis worked, plain and simple. Credibility is nothing in the music industry. I'm more concerned about what the song is saying than the artist. Which means if I hear something I dig by the Backstreet Boys, I'm not gonna shudder and say "But I CAN'T like them because they're the Backstreet Boys!"

You're dealing with a world of lies in the music industry. If you choose to base what you listen to on what the artist has or has not said outside of the recording studio - so be it.

I'd just rather listen to the music.




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Papercuts!
Potato korv








Since: 3.1.02
From: Springfield, Mo.

Since last post: 4443 days
Last activity: 4353 days
#16 Posted on
Originally posted by cfgb
EXCEPT that the public backlashed against them according to you - whereas they did not for Alanis



Only because Alanis has a better publicity rep from her record company to control her image.

And bear in mind here, I'm not being confrontational or anything. I'm just discussing, now, how things work with record companies.

The whole Vanilla Ice "I was born a poor black child" fiasco is why SMART artists/groups that have been fabricated by a record company work carefully with handlers -- so conflicting information doesn't get out.

I think you said it yourself -- yep, You did.


You're dealing with a world of lies in the music industry. If you choose to base what you listen to on what the artist has or has not said outside of the recording studio - so be it.



You're very right here.

My issue stems from a couple simple facts: 1) I don't like her music. Kim described it best above. 2.) It stuck in my craw for some reason when DJs and other "pop culture purveyors" would talk about how "angry, genuine and intense" she is when I knew it was patently false. And because I felt she performed boring and unoriginal music while people were buying into her act by the boatloads -- why is it you had to be "angry" and "disenfranchised" to be an "alternative artist" there for awhile? -- while other, more deserving talents without an "act" fell by the wayside, I got a little bitter. So yeah. It's my bad.

Basically, I was the kid in the audience that knew how the magician was doing all his tricks.



Jason Baldwin
Head Writer, 4-Color Review
And the guy behind PAPER CUTS!
TRUTHFUL comic book commentary
Every Thursday, only at 4-Color Review
http://4colorreview.com
Jobberman
Kishke








Since: 2.1.02
From: West Palm Beach, FL

Since last post: 59 days
Last activity: 21 days
#17 Posted on


I'm not proclaiming to be an Alanis history expert, but from what I have seen on her past I would have to disagree a little. Yeah she had a past as a teeny-bopper dance song thing, but she was only like 16 when she got the record deal and was nothing more than a pawn of the record label. They wrote the stuff and she sang it. As far as Jagged Little Pill goes, I've read interviews by both Glenn Ballard and Alanis where they say the songwriting was a joint effort, and that most of the lyrics were hers.
spf
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: The Las Vegas of Canada

Since last post: 62 days
Last activity: 1 day
AIM:  
#18 Posted on
I never understood why the Grammy was taken from the Milli Vanilli album when it was revealed that the assumed singers didn't do the songs. It was still the exact same album, simply the pretty people singing it were revealed as frauds. To me that was the Grammies admitting it's all about image rather than the music, since if the album was what propelled them to the Best New Artist, really the Grammy should have just transferred to the real singers. I guess dance moves and hair extensions are just as important though.



There, I feel better now.
cfgb
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Ottawa, Ontario

Since last post: 15 hours
Last activity: 3 hours
#19 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.87
why is it you had to be "angry" and "disenfranchised" to be an "alternative artist" there for awhile?

You forgot to mention hot as well?

Whoops, I think I just shot my credibility in the foot. :-)

I remember Alanis from her days on You Can't Do That On Television. Perhaps the numerous slimings she took caused all the anger to explode and end her teenie bopping?




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rte66usa
Polska kielbasa








Since: 2.1.02

Since last post: 4601 days
Last activity: 4596 days
#20 Posted on
In response to the Milli Vanilli comment: No, I didn't have a problem with it. I DO find it funny as hell that "Girl You Know It's True" was a monster hit, then when it was revealed the two "cute" guys didn't really perform it, it was a HORRIBLE song. Please. It was still just as great a song as it was when it was released (which in my mind was horrible in the first place), no matter who did it and it still deserved to beat Soundgarden. I don't care WHO puts out the song and who they use to market it. A good song is a good song. Period. I don't care if David Gilmour leads Pink Floyd on a sell-out (in more ways than one) greatest hits tour while Roger Waters chases the trucks shouting "That's my pig!" I don't care if Journey toured and recorded last year with a lead singer nobody's ever heard of but who looks and sounds like Steve Perry, especially when they actually put out a better record that the last two Steve Perry/Journey albums.

Music just isn't that important. Maybe the musicians and record companies would like to THINK music is that important, but it's not. It's just a 2/4 beat with a memorable riff and a catchy chorus line and maybe a creative lyric that will inspire somebody with no life to kill themselves or maybe say something like "Man, I can really relate to that 'go down on you in a theatre' line. That woman is angry." Yeah yeah yeah. Get a life. I wrote a song once called "Set Your Face on Fire and Wreck" about a guy speeding in his car and setting his beard on fire while trying to light a cigarette (he coudn't see through the flames and he hit a tree). It included the line "flicked my Bic and started to fry so I set my face on fire and wrecked and now I'm finally FREE". Imagine what prophetic statements I'd be claimed to be making for the youth of today on THAT marketing campaign!

Is the whole point that these artists are holding the "real" artists back? Who are the real "artists"? My favorite recording artist of all time is Wendy Waldman. Never heard of Wendy? She put out seven brilliant solo albums (five on Warner Bros) that nobody bought. She has two amazing albums with her band Bryndle (the new one just out and only available at www.bryndle.com). The critics adore her. So how come you've never heard of her?

Well, maybe you've heard of "Save the Best for Last" by Vanessa Williams. Look at the writing credit some time. Same with Don Johnson's minor hit "Heartbeat".

So do I feel that Alanis, Milli, Vanilla Ice, every artist who samples, and the 20-years-beyond-the-welcome-mat dino-rockers like Aerosmith are holding Wendy back from being a superstar? No, I feel the masses choosing to buy those artists are. I don't blame the horrible schlock that is FM radio (which I worked in for fifteen years) or the humans dumb enough to listen to it. I don't blame MTV. I don't blame anybody.

It's only rock and roll.

PS - Jeff didn't fit in the image. I was going to go with Burgerilla, but heck with it. Besides, admit it. Burger Chef and Jeff today would just be considered for a pedophile case.


(edited by rte66usa on 22.1.02 1642)
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