I'm launching this thread as a place to freely discuss the A Song of Ice and Fire books outside of the Game of Thrones HBO TV show thread so no one watching the show is spoiled.
I should note that I've read A Game of Thrones, A Clash of Kings, and I'm 300 pages away from finishing A Storm of Swords, so my comments will be about those three books and have SPOILERS. I guess anyone who hasn't read as far as I have will also be spoiled. Sorry.
ALSO: NO ONE SPOIL ME ABOUT A FEAST FOR CROWS PLEASE.
We'll have to try to figure out this whole "don't spoil what for me" situation in this thread. Maybe there should be threads for each book? Is that necessary? You decide.
Anyway, here's what I wrote in the other thread, to kick this off:
Originally posted by CxMorgadoStorm melted my brain when I read it.
Right now, I think Storm of Swords is the best of the three A Song of Ice and Fire books I've read, if I'm defining "best" as the one that fucked me up emotionally the most. I mean, Ned Stark's death has NOTHING on what Lord Walder Frey did to Robb and Catelyn. And Arya! (Is she still by some chance alive? Please? I still have 300 odd pages to go but I'm hoping against hope Arya survived the axe to the head from the hound. I KNEW Bran and Rickon's death was a ruse in Clash of Kings, but I put nothing past the ruthlessness of George RR Martin.) The kicker for Arya's story is SHE WAS SO CLOSE, after all the shit she went through. Her mother and brother were RIGHT THERE... being gruesomely slaughtered. God damn you, Martin!
And in a way, the existence of the show makes the experience of reading the books cruelly worse. Because now I have mental images of the characters looking like the actors. With Clash of Kings, I saw Sophie Turner in my head being beaten bloody when Joffrey had Sansa beaten. I always see Maisie Williams in my head doing what Arya's doing - and I saw Maisie's head get pounded with that axe by the Hound in my mind's eye. And Robb and Catelyn! Jesus. Why did Martin have to outright describe Robb's head chopped off and Grey Wind's head chopped off and Grey Wind's head nailed to Robb's corpse with Robb's crown on his head? And Catelyn flung naked into the River? Martin, you sick bastard.
The Starks are like the Von Erichs of Westeros.
(edited by John Orquiola on 16.6.11 1100) @BackoftheHead
After Ned's death I thought well they are not going to continue to do just kill major characters off. In book two, you get the sense well there are five books left, I am sure a few of them will deal with Robb as King while Jon is on the Wall. So far, I am half way right. The Fucking Red Wedding maybe one of the most OMG moments of all time You sense something is wrong with the wedding and you figure it will come during the ceremony and when it doesn't you get pulled into a false sense of security then shit hits the fan.
You have to believe the ramifications for the Tully family has to be huge. Even with his I don't give a fuck attitude,Baby Daddy or Grand Baby Daddy Tully has to realize he is going to pay for this. Out of all the kingdoms I see falling to the Others, his is probably the first one or two to go. Yet, knowing GRR Martin, he probably gets the Iron Throne in the end turning the throne into a joke both for the literature aspect and for the readers.
Since you are not done with book three, I will just say that Arya being there seemed more like a stall tactic and its not the last one. I will warn you now Book 4 is all about set-up. I am not saying nothing happens, shit happens, serious shit happens, but its rather boring. Book 5 which is less then a month away needs to come out swinging to get the boredom of Book 4 out of my mind.
(edited by lotjx on 16.6.11 1254) The Wee Baby Sheamus.
Twitter: @realjoecarfley its a bit more toned down there. A bit.
I'm just spitballing a guess here, but when I got over the shock of what happened to Robb and I started counting the remaining Starks, I remembered the scene before the wedding at the Freys where Robb talked about finding a way to get Jon Snow's oath to the Night's Watch overruled so he could be heir to Winterfell. Catelyn hated THAT idea, but why introduce it at all?
I have a sneaking suspicion that in terms of Who Will Ultimately Rule Winterfell, it could come down to Ned Stark's bastard's claim vs. Tyrion Lannister's claim as husband to Sansa. That would be fascinating because Tyrion and Jon are friends from way back when Jon first joined the Night's Watch and Tyrion visited the Wall. But then, that would require George RR Martin actually adhering to some time-honored tenets of storytelling, and Martin delights in stomping all over those. You never know what Martin is going to do. I'm always on edge reading these books. Anything can happen!
As for A Feast for Crows being boring, I could do with something more easygoing after the emotional roller coaster of the last 3 books. I'm looking forward to A Dance with Dragons as well.
One of things I like about Westeros is that it seems like the three worst things a citizen of Westeros can do is: 1) Oathbreaking, 2) Violating the rules of hospitality, 3) being a Kingslayer (which is also 1).
Cap's death was pulled off really well in his ongoing, but this mini series just trivializes the whole thing. The writing is total crap. Loeb has also been disregarding character continuity over in Wolverine as well.