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The 7 - Baseball - Hall of Fame ballot 02-03 Register and log in to post!
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jfkfc
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#21 Posted on 4.12.02 2213.08
Reposted on: 4.12.09 2215.03

    Originally posted by edturtle
    Bert was great. But I can see how he isn't perceived as a great. But damn was that curveball fantastic
Bert was one my favorite non-Yanks of all time, and yeah, his curveball friggin ruled. Being great and being a great, as you seemed to be pointing out, are two different things, though the line is a thin one.

Of course there aren't too many players who you tell yourself are amongst the greatest of all time. If you look at the game today, though, you can see probable HOF'ers all over the place, guys who dominate for most or all of their career. Henderson, Pedro, Unit, Maddox, Clemens, Pudge, Sosa, Piazza, Griffey Jr...these are guys who have dominated for years, IMO. Lots of other guys might make it too - Glavine, Palmiero (not Orlando), Walker, Frank Thomas, Justice, McGriff, Bernie, Smoltz...just to throw a few names out there, guys who have been around for around 10 years or so.
BigDaddyLoco
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#22 Posted on 4.12.02 2241.53
Reposted on: 4.12.09 2242.49
One of you guys is going to have to give me the hard sell on Sandberg because I'm just not seeing it.
TheCow
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#23 Posted on 4.12.02 2347.43
Reposted on: 4.12.09 2358.35
As of now, I'd probably be against Griffey Jr. making the Hall. I'm aware he's been injured for most of the past few years, yes, and he's still got a ways to go before he's old enough to retire, but he's had either 3 or 4 years of virtual non-production, and that doesn't look good on a Hall of Fame ballot. Now, if he turns around and has a couple of good years, he's in there for sure. It's just that right now, history won't look too kindly on the last few years Griffey has had.

Is this to say he's not a great player when he's healthy? Not by a longshot. It's just that I don't think he should get in if he's been injured a lot of this time.
jfkfc
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#24 Posted on 5.12.02 0959.59
Reposted on: 5.12.09 1010.42

    Originally posted by TheCow
    As of now, I'd probably be against Griffey Jr. making the Hall.
I really disagree on this, so let me explain Grif. First and foremost, I think Junior is a punk-ass beyotch, with all of that crying he did about George and Billy Martin when he was a kid. That said -

'90-'01 (not counting 2002)
More than 40 HRs - 7 times
More than 50 HRs - twice, 56 in consecutive years (and hit 40 HR in the strike-shortened '94 season)
More than 100 RBI - 8 (4 times over 130)
More than 100 Runs - 6

He has some fearsome stats from the 90's, and in 2001 he still hit 22 HR in only 111 games. 468 career HR, he will definitely reach 500, and that is pretty exclusive company.


    Originally posted by BigDaddyLoco
    One of you guys is going to have to give me the hard sell on Sandberg because I'm just not seeing it.
I always thought that Ryne Sandburg was Cal Ripken Jr. playing 2B without the streak. In my opinion, again, he was a great defensive 2B, I would say up there will Robby Alomar Jr., who could hit for power.

6 years over 25 HR (max 40 in '90, 285 career)
9 years over 20 SB (max 54 in '85, 344 career)

The only thing that killed him was playing for the Cubs.
edturtle
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#25 Posted on 5.12.02 1514.46
Reposted on: 5.12.09 1518.46

    Originally posted by jfkfc

      Originally posted by TheCow
      As of now, I'd probably be against Griffey Jr. making the Hall.
    I really disagree on this, so let me explain Grif. First and foremost, I think Junior is a punk-ass beyotch, with all of that crying he did about George and Billy Martin when he was a kid. That said -

    '90-'01 (not counting 2002)
    More than 40 HRs - 7 times
    More than 50 HRs - twice, 56 in consecutive years (and hit 40 HR in the strike-shortened '94 season)
    More than 100 RBI - 8 (4 times over 130)
    More than 100 Runs - 6

    He has some fearsome stats from the 90's, and in 2001 he still hit 22 HR in only 111 games. 468 career HR, he will definitely reach 500, and that is pretty exclusive company.




    God, it's so hard to believe how good Griffey was - and how far he's fallen.



    [quoteheadOriginally posted by jfkfc


      Originally posted by BigDaddyLoco
      One of you guys is going to have to give me the hard sell on Sandberg because I'm just not seeing it.
    I always thought that Ryne Sandburg was Cal Ripken Jr. playing 2B without the streak. In my opinion, again, he was a great defensive 2B, I would say up there will Robby Alomar Jr., who could hit for power.

    6 years over 25 HR (max 40 in '90, 285 career)
    9 years over 20 SB (max 54 in '85, 344 career)

    The only thing that killed him was playing for the Cubs.




Yeah, you have to bear in mind the power numbers Ryno put up were historical for a 2nd baseman. I mean, we're talking Rogers Hornsby area here. And in a repressed offensive era to boot. That said, he DID do it in a friendly ballpark. Even so, the power numbers added to all the GG's and an MVP makes him sure-fire. Depending on how Alomar Jr ends his career, Ryno's 3rd best 2nd baseman of all time behind Morgan and Hornsby.

The Masked Hungarian
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#26 Posted on 5.12.02 1744.52
Reposted on: 5.12.09 1746.39
1) Bruce Sutter SHOULD be in the Hall of Fame..just not now. The guy did invent the split finger fastball AND EARNED HIS SAVES..none of that one inning bullshit we see today. Again not saying he should go in this year but eventually yes

2) Daryl Kile is nowhere near a hall of famer

3) Gary Carter was THE catcher of the 80s. He HAS to get in

4) Best quote ever by EdTurtle, "Everyone's throwing Glavine's name around like he's getting close to becoming a sure thing HOFer, but there ain't a whole lot of difference 'tween Glavine and John, Kaat, 'cept for the Cy Young's."

That's like saying me and HHH are very similiar..except for 150 lbs and millions of dollars

My Hall ballot:

Eddie Murray, Gary Carter and Keith Hernandez..if only to help give him the minimum 5% and keep him on the ballot



(edited by The Masked Hungarian on 5.12.02 1846)
darkdragoon
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#27 Posted on 5.12.02 2021.03
Reposted on: 5.12.09 2029.02

    Originally posted by TheCow
    As of now, I'd probably be against Griffey Jr. making the Hall. I'm aware he's been injured for most of the past few years, yes, and he's still got a ways to go before he's old enough to retire, but he's had either 3 or 4 years of virtual non-production, and that doesn't look good on a Hall of Fame ballot. Now, if he turns around and has a couple of good years, he's in there for sure. It's just that right now, history won't look too kindly on the last few years Griffey has had.

    Is this to say he's not a great player when he's healthy? Not by a longshot. It's just that I don't think he should get in if he's been injured a lot of this time.



Except that according to the hype, he should be FAR ahead of Bonds by this time...plus his decision to leave Seattle was probably as unwise as ARod's.
edturtle
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#28 Posted on 6.12.02 1330.31
Reposted on: 6.12.09 1331.52

    Originally posted by The Masked Hungarian
    1) Bruce Sutter SHOULD be in the Hall of Fame..just not now. The guy did invent the split finger fastball AND EARNED HIS SAVES..none of that one inning bullshit we see today. Again not saying he should go in this year but eventually yes


    Sutter didn't invent the splitter, per se. He just perfected it.

    But I'm with ya on Sutter as a REAL closer. Same with Goose.


    2) Daryl Kile is nowhere near a hall of famer


    Not even close


    3) Gary Carter was THE catcher of the 80s. He HAS to get in

    4) Best quote ever by EdTurtle, "Everyone's throwing Glavine's name around like he's getting close to becoming a sure thing HOFer, but there ain't a whole lot of difference 'tween Glavine and John, Kaat, 'cept for the Cy Young's."

    That's like saying me and HHH are very similiar..except for 150 lbs and millions of dollars


    I was on a roll and then I remember Glavine's Cy. *sigh* Sometimes I should have more faith in the Delete button. =)

    What I THINK I meant/mean is that they're the same type of pitchers. Glavine got a Cy due in large part to being on a better team than John or Kaat were for the bulk of their careers.

    I'm...backing...away...slowly...Move along. Nothing to see here. I've killed my cred with the earlier quote already. =)

    I blame the cold medicine!!!
The Masked Hungarian
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#29 Posted on 6.12.02 1634.52
Reposted on: 6.12.09 1638.26
You still got cred

I will say (even though I am a biased Mets fan) that Glavine should only get in the Hall IF he gets 300 wins. Anything less and he's on the fence

Of course I'm hoping he wins another 100 but that's just me!
TheCow
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#30 Posted on 6.12.02 2023.48
Reposted on: 6.12.09 2026.11
Hey, I'm not too picky.

I just want him to win a couple of playoff games in the next 3 years.
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