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23.6.11 0515
The 7 - Pro Wrestling - Zack Ryder...what am I missing?
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Scottyflamingo
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#1 Posted on 14.6.11 1133.03
Reposted on: 14.6.18 1133.31
Subject says it all.
Promote this thread!
CRZ
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#2 Posted on 14.6.11 1134.47
Reposted on: 14.6.18 1134.48
    Originally posted by Scottyflamingo
    Subject says it all.
I like to guess who starts threads when I see the tweet from @The_W.

I can now consistently tell you apart from CajunMan. Congratulations to all of us!

EDIT: What I meant to say was go back to this thread from May, for starters (The W).

(edited by CRZ on 14.6.11 1137)
JustinShapiro
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#3 Posted on 14.6.11 1304.16
Reposted on: 14.6.18 1305.02
I guess everything. Hilarious dude and lifelong wrestling fan. Indistinguishable FCWbot who created his own character and catchphrases, and got over on ECW. Wasn't being used on TV after that so he took the initiative even further -- in the company up its own ass about guys having to make their own breaks and show that they want it and brass ring blah blah blah -- and started his own internet show, which seems to have a good deal of thought and effort put into it and has developed a big following. Got over with a flipcam while WWE oversees lots of hand-picked busts. Works really hard and had quality matches with the Bourne/Tatsu/Primos of the world on Superstars. Twitters videos of himself singing songs in his car with the lyrics changed to be about himself. Seems like a swell guy. Rudy from the film Rudy to his peers. Ticks all the boxes for internet martyrdom yet isn't even an undersized flyer guy who can't talk well, which makes WWE's lack of interest harder to understand.

(edited by JustinShapiro on 14.6.11 1439)
odessasteps
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#4 Posted on 14.6.11 1415.39
Reposted on: 14.6.18 1417.31
    Originally posted by JustinShapiro
    I guess everything. Hilarious dude and lifelong wrestling fan. Indistinguishable FCWbot who created his own character and catchphrases, and got over on ECW. Wasn't being used on TV after that so he took the initiative even further -- in the company up its own ass about guys having to make their own breaks and show that they want it and brass ring blah blah blah -- and started his own internet show, which seems to have a good deal of thought and effort put into it and has developed a big following. Got over with a flipcam while WWE oversees lots of hand-picked busts. Works really hard and had quality matches with the Bourne/Tatsu/Primos of the world on Superstars. Twitters videos of himself singing songs in his car with the lyrics changed to be about himself. Seems like a swell guy. Rudy from the film Rudy to his peers. Ticks all the boxes for internet martyrdom yet isn't even an undersized flyer guy who can't talk well, which makes WWE's lack of interest harder to understand.




you forgot former Edgehead.
BigDaddyLoco
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#5 Posted on 14.6.11 1456.39
Reposted on: 14.6.18 1456.59
    Originally posted by JustinShapiro
    I guess everything. Hilarious dude and lifelong wrestling fan. Indistinguishable FCWbot who created his own character and catchphrases, and got over on ECW. Wasn't being used on TV after that so he took the initiative even further -- in the company up its own ass about guys having to make their own breaks and show that they want it and brass ring blah blah blah -- and started his own internet show, which seems to have a good deal of thought and effort put into it and has developed a big following. Got over with a flipcam while WWE oversees lots of hand-picked busts. Works really hard and had quality matches with the Bourne/Tatsu/Primos of the world on Superstars. Twitters videos of himself singing songs in his car with the lyrics changed to be about himself. Seems like a swell guy. Rudy from the film Rudy to his peers. Ticks all the boxes for internet martyrdom yet isn't even an undersized flyer guy who can't talk well, which makes WWE's lack of interest harder to understand.

    (edited by JustinShapiro on 14.6.11 1439)


Is he being held back for getting too over on his own? I know it sounds dumb, but Vince and the crew always like to have their finger prints on everyones gimmicks no matter how small just like my dog has to pee on every tree when we go for a walk.

He doesn't have to be on the top of the card, but if WWE can find a place for Santino and The Great Khali every week surely there is five minutes a show for Ryder.
John Orquiola
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#6 Posted on 14.6.11 1514.14
Reposted on: 14.6.18 1515.02
Why doesn't WWE push Zack Ryder? WWE is Vince McMahon.

Vince McMahon is a very rich, very, very busy man running various levels of his global entertainment corporation when not hanging and banging in the gym and flexing for himself in the mirror. He is also in his mid-60's. My point is, he is not "hip". He is not "with it" or "down with what the kids are up to". Nor does he have the time or inclination to be, when his mindset has always been the HE WILL TELL YOU WHAT YOU WANT.

The people on his Creative team who might be hip or with it are afraid of him and cater their Creative to Vince's well-established likes and dislikes. He also surrounds himself with senior advisors who are former pro-wrestlers in their 40s and 50s who are also not "hip" or "with it", and are also afraid of him.

His 35 year old daughter who runs Creative is also a wife and mother of three who is also likely increasingly disconnected with what "the kids" are up to. The likes and preferences of kids she and her 41 year old retired pro wrestler husband, who used to be the epitome of "hip" 12 years ago, are more familiar with now are under the age of 10. They know better now what toddlers like than what 20 year olds like.

How much time does any McMahon or Lesveque spend watching things on YouTube or trying to keep up with whatever social media trends are happening? Very, very little, I would wager.

Regardless, in WWE, the final say, the decider, the buck always stops with Vince McMahon.

When you see a comedy act like Santino Marella or the Great Khali, they are there because this is comedy the 65-year old Chairman of WWE likes and understands, and his Creative staff knows he likes and understands. This is why Mae Young getting drunk and kissing a man a 4th her age still happens on a regular basis.

What Zack Ryder is doing entertains the boys and the young people in Creative but there is a massive gap between that and the attention and approval of Vince McMahon.

What is Zack Ryder doing on YouTube, and why should Vincent Kennedy McMahon care? Someone explain it to him before Ryder is future endeavored.

(edited by John Orquiola on 14.6.11 1551)
Matt Tracker
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#7 Posted on 14.6.11 1607.22
Reposted on: 14.6.18 1608.19
Is it true Paul Burchill's pirate gimmick was cut down because Vince didn't know about the success of 'Pirates of the Caribbean?'
geemoney
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#8 Posted on 14.6.11 1609.02
Reposted on: 14.6.18 1609.05
    Originally posted by Matt Tracker
    Is it true Paul Burchill's pirate gimmick was cut down because Vince didn't know about the success of 'Pirates of the Caribbean?'


Based on Dave Lagana's "Formerly Creative" podcasts, Vince was the one who wanted Burchill to be the pirate - those in creative speculated that he had recently seen the "Pirates" movie, or he said he had or something like that.
Scottyflamingo
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#9 Posted on 14.6.11 1658.08
Reposted on: 14.6.18 1659.01
Ok, I can respect a guy who loves the business as much as the next guy, but I don't see his act as something I'd want to see in the main events or even major angles. Hell, what's the difference between his schtick and Robby E?

Zeruel
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#10 Posted on 14.6.11 1749.33
Reposted on: 14.6.18 1749.52
    Originally posted by Scottyflamingo
    Hell, what's the difference between his schtick and Robby E?




Robbie E is a cheap one-dimensional rip-off/imitation of Pauly D of The Jersey Shore.

Zack Ryder started as a McPopColler-yuppie-bar type parody that has evolved to more than just a pale, quick cash-in, imitation of a reality show star. He developed non-Jersey Shore catchphrases "Woo woo woo, you know it" and a nickname "Long Island Iced Z" and it appears that he is going 110% into this character to really make it click and it is working.

I don't even like Ryder, but I can see why other people do. I mostly hate the character because back in 2007, I had friends get drunk screaming "YOU KNOW IT!" from Will Farrel from Old School all the time and was funny at first but it got REALLY annoying real fast as they would scream it an hour straight.




geemoney
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#11 Posted on 14.6.11 1816.03
Reposted on: 14.6.18 1816.05
    Originally posted by Scottyflamingo
    Ok, I can respect a guy who loves the business as much as the next guy, but I don't see his act as something I'd want to see in the main events or even major angles.


I don't like or dislike characters based on whether I can see them as main eventers or in major angles. I like or dislike characters based on whether or not they entertain me. Zack Ryder does, therefore, I'd like to see him on TV more often than once every three months.
odessasteps
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#12 Posted on 14.6.11 2030.22
Reposted on: 14.6.18 2031.30
    Originally posted by Scottyflamingo
    Ok, I can respect a guy who loves the business as much as the next guy, but I don't see his act as something I'd want to see in the main events or even major angles. Hell, what's the difference between his schtick and Robby E?




I dont think most of his fans want him in main events.

I think they'd like to see him on RAW/SD and not just Superstars or doing dark matches.
Moss
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#13 Posted on 14.6.11 2100.28
Reposted on: 14.6.18 2100.29
I want him in main events eventually, for now he needs some TV time and a decent program. If they put half the effort into Z as they are Big Zeke he'd be huge.

    Originally posted by John Orquiola
    My point is, he is not "hip". He is not "with it" or "down with what the kids are up to".


And yet an old lump of Cole like JR is a fan, and Stone Cold, who did a Rick Roll in 2011 (an admittedly entertaining one) is now a member of the Zack Pack. Which makes it even sadder he can't get on Raw when it's in his hometown.

I know a guy who went to the Raw is LI and said Ryder's Superstars appearance got a HUGE pop, maybe they'll finally figure it out.
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#14 Posted on 14.6.11 2154.22
Reposted on: 14.6.18 2155.27
Based on how JR and others are treated in their hometowns, should we be HAPPY he wasn't on TV?

Anyway, J-Sharp laid down why Zack Ryder is awesome. #WWWYKI, bro.
CruelAngel777
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#15 Posted on 14.6.11 2204.33
Reposted on: 14.6.18 2205.49
Zach Ryder has a comedy gimmick. Vince isn't gonna let too many wrestlers on tv with a comedy gimmick. Since he already has Hornswoggle and Santino he's not gonna put another jester superstar on tv. I honestly believe that's the reason Colt Cabana never stood a chance of making it on TV. Not enough room in the class clown genre. Zach's especially not main event material. Maybe if they made him a believable bad-ass or made him serious, but that would kill his fanbase plus I don't see the potential.

There is always plenty of room and need for jobbers though. He's excellent in that.
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#16 Posted on 14.6.11 2237.44
Reposted on: 14.6.18 2240.31
I just don't see how it HURTS Vince to embrace a Zack Ryder. Its a little ridiculous to squash any glimpse of momentum that your talent drums up, especially given the glaring lack of babyfaces. As a promoter, why wouldn't you want to exploit it while there is some buzz?

Someone mentioned Dave Lagana's podcast, 'I Want Wrestling'. If you're at all into the creative aspect of WWE, its a must listen. Granted, some of the info is obviously coming from disgruntled former employees - but you really start to understand how utterly retarded the behind the curtain environment in the company is.

Which makes Meltzer's story about how this was all a big rib on Ryder by Vince (apparently making Zack think he was going to get a promo and face turn on Monday) sound commonplace.

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