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The 7 - Baseball - Blyleven & Alomar into 2011 Hall Of Fame. Register and log in to post!
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JimBob Skeeter
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#1 Posted on 5.1.11 1310.41
Reposted on: 5.1.18 1312.42
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/hof11/news/story?id=5991808

NEW YORK -- Roberto Alomar and Bert Blyleven have been elected to baseball's Hall of Fame.

Alomar and Blyleven were chosen Wednesday by the Baseball Writers' Association of America after narrow misses last year.

Alomar was picked on 90 percent of the ballots. He was a 12-time All-Star and 10-time Gold Glove winner at second base.

Blyleven was listed on more than 79 percent of the ballots, above the 75 percent required for election. He won 287 games and ranks fifth on the career strikeout list.

Sluggers Rafael Palmeiro, Jeff Bagwell and Mark McGwire all fell below the 50 percent mark.

The induction ceremony will be held on July 24 in Cooperstown.

-----------------------------------------------------------

Good for them both, but I'm especially excited for Blyleven seeing him on every Twins broadcast. Hell, he got away with saying "Fuck" a couple of times on tv and not fired for it. He's da man!
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CRZ
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#2 Posted on 5.1.11 1312.43
Reposted on: 5.1.18 1312.43
See, all I was thinking was "hey, maybe THIS'LL shut Bert up."

From www.bbwaa.com...
2011 Hall of Fame voting
Name Votes Pct.
Roberto Alomar 523 90.0%
Bert Blyleven 463 79.7%
---
Barry Larkin 361 62.1%
Jack Morris 311 53.5%
Lee Smith 263 45.3%
Jeff Bagwell 242 41.7%
Tim Raines 218 37.5%
Edgar Martinez 191 32.9%
Alan Trammell 141 24.3%
Larry Walker 118 20.3%
Mark McGwire 115 19.8%
Fred McGriff 104 17.9%
Dave Parker 89 15.3%
Don Mattingly 79 13.6%
Dale Murphy 73 12.6%
Rafael Palmeiro 64 11.0%
Juan Gonzalez 30 5.2%
---
Harold Baines 28 4.8%
John Franco 27 4.6%
Kevin Brown 12 2.1%
Tino Martinez 6 1.0%
Marquis Grissom 4 0.7%
Al Leiter 4 0.7%
John Olerud 4 0.7%
B.J. Surhoff 2 0.3%
Bret Boone 1 0.2%
Benito Santiago 1 0.2%
Carlos Baerga 0 0.0%
Lenny Harris 0 0.0%
Bobby Higginson 0 0.0%
Charles Johnson 0 0.0%
Raul Mondesi 0 0.0%
Kirk Rueter 0 0.0%
Note: 436 votes (75%) required for enshrinement. Induction July 24, 2011 in Cooperstown, N.Y.
El Nastio
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#3 Posted on 5.1.11 1314.23
Reposted on: 5.1.18 1314.40
It's about time Bert "Be Home" Blyleven made it. And with 4% to spare! Alomar should've been voted in last year though.

Hopefully people will take up the zeal they had for Blyleven and throw their efforts behind Tim Raines and Egdar Martinez.
Big Bad
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#4 Posted on 5.1.11 1316.44
Reposted on: 5.1.18 1316.52
As a longtime Blue Jays fan, it's great to see Alomar get inducted as the first player in the HOF wearing a Toronto cap. And Blyleven was so overdue for the Hall that it was ridiculous that he hadn't already been inducted.

There were a ton of other guys on this year's ballot I would've voted for --- Larkin, Bagwell, Raines, Walker, Martinez, Trammell and even McGwire. The good news is that there's nothing but stiffs on the 2012 incoming ballot, so I suspect several of these holdovers will get inducted next year

(edited by Big Bad on 5.1.11 1440)
spf
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#5 Posted on 5.1.11 1317.44
Reposted on: 5.1.18 1329.01
I see Tim Raines becoming the next "why isn't he in the HOF" guy, esp. as more stats oriented voices continue to be in the discussion. Essentially Tim Raines is penalized for not being Rickey Henderson, which is kind of crazy to me.
odessasteps
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#6 Posted on 5.1.11 1326.28
Reposted on: 5.1.18 1329.04

I'm guessing Raines' big minus was his drug problem and infamous "stole a base sliding because he had coke vial in his back pocket" story.
The Goon
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#7 Posted on 5.1.11 1411.01
Reposted on: 5.1.18 1412.58
Woohoo Robbie Alomar!

Now I won't be upset when people stop me on the street and say, "Hey, do you know you look like Roberto Alomar?"

(Granted, this hasn't happened in 15 years.)
Bullitt
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#8 Posted on 5.1.11 1442.15
Reposted on: 5.1.18 1443.30
New Hall of Famer Robbie Alomar wants you to "Catch da taste!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnu9DCLJtRE
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#9 Posted on 5.1.11 1545.34
Reposted on: 5.1.18 1549.20
    Originally posted by El Nastio
    It's about time Bert "Be Home" Blyleven made it. And with 4% to spare! Alomar should've been voted in last year though.

    Hopefully people will take up the zeal they had for Blyleven and throw their efforts behind Tim Raines and Egdar Martinez.


You spelled Jack Morris wrong. Twice in fact.
spf
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#10 Posted on 5.1.11 1601.29
Reposted on: 5.1.18 1606.44
    Originally posted by StaggerLee
      Originally posted by El Nastio
      It's about time Bert "Be Home" Blyleven made it. And with 4% to spare! Alomar should've been voted in last year though.

      Hopefully people will take up the zeal they had for Blyleven and throw their efforts behind Tim Raines and Egdar Martinez.


    You spelled Jack Morris wrong. Twice in fact.


Two major league pitchers from the last 30 years. Both of them were the starting and winning pitcher in World Series clinching games with 1-0 scores in the last 20 years. Both have over a decade of pitching in the majors as a starter.

.605 Winning Percentage
4.13 ERA
109 ERA+
1.299 WHIP
6.5 K/9
8.8 H/9
2.28 K/BB

.577 Winning Percentage
3.90 ERA
105 ERA+
1.296 WHIP
5.8 K/9
8.4 H/9
1.78 K/BB

Which one of these is championed as a should-be Hall of Famer, and which one is unlikely to get a single vote when he retires?


Spoiler Below: Highlight text to read
Pitcher #1 is Freddy Garcia. Pitcher #2 is Jack Morris
thecubsfan
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#11 Posted on 5.1.11 1633.27
Reposted on: 5.1.18 1633.41

Spoiler Below: Highlight text to read
Not fair. Big Game Freddie would be in the HOF if not for Bobby Jenks. Oney told me so.
El Nastio
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#12 Posted on 5.1.11 1634.20
Reposted on: 5.1.18 1637.00
    Originally posted by StaggerLee
      Originally posted by El Nastio
      It's about time Bert "Be Home" Blyleven made it. And with 4% to spare! Alomar should've been voted in last year though.

      Hopefully people will take up the zeal they had for Blyleven and throw their efforts behind Tim Raines and Egdar Martinez.


    You spelled Jack Morris wrong. Twice in fact.


Tim Raines has an excellent case, the only reason he hasn't been voted in yet is because;

1) Henderson cast a long shadow.
2) MLB doesn't like the Expos.

Martinez has the DH stigma attached to him, but people are forgetting that Molitor got The Call and the majority of his at-bats were as a DH. And have you seen Martinez's stat lines? He's an all-time great hitter. ALL-TIME. All-timers need to be in the Hall.

As for Morris, here's some stats from JoePo;

Bert Blyleven won more games with an ERA more than a half run lower and an ERA+ advantage of 118-105. Blyleven struck out 1,223 more batters but, even more remarkably, walked 68 fewer batters. Why are the walks more remarkable? Because Blyleven threw 1,146 more innings than Morris. That’s 127 nine-inning games if you’re scoring at home. And he still walked fewer batters.

Blyleven had a reputation as a gopherball pitcher — well-earned, since his 50 homers allowed in 1986 is still the record — but he gave up fewer homers per nine than Morris. Blyleven threw more than twice as many shutouts, threw 70 more complete games, had a significantly lower WHIP, and he has more than twice as many Wins Above Replacement (90.1 to 39.3)

And it should have dissipated. Maybe Bert Blyleven did not have a reputation as a great big-game pitcher, but 5-1, 2.47 ERA in the postseason (one of those wins coming over sainted big-game pitcher Jack Morris) and his record in 1-0 games suggest that he didn’t really let that reputation stop him from pitching well in big games.


Sorry Stagger, but Morris really should wait a decade or so before his Call.
spf
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#13 Posted on 5.1.11 1637.47
Reposted on: 5.1.18 1640.21
    Originally posted by thecubsfan

    Spoiler Below: Highlight text to read
    Not fair. Big Game Freddie would be in the HOF if not for Bobby Jenks. Oney told me so.


My bad. I should never doubt the spoiled son of a lunatic again.
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#14 Posted on 5.1.11 2126.40
Reposted on: 5.1.18 2129.01
    Originally posted by El Nastio
      Originally posted by StaggerLee
        Originally posted by El Nastio

        Martinez has the DH stigma attached to him, but people are forgetting that Molitor got The Call and the majority of his at-bats were as a DH. And have you seen Martinez's stat lines? He's an all-time great hitter. ALL-TIME. All-timers need to be in the Hall.




      I'm fine with Edgar getting in as long as Bagwell gets in first. It's insane to me that he only got half the votes he needed. Six consecutive years of 30 home runs, 100 RBI and 100 runs (only 1B to match that are Gehrig and Foxx). Scored over 1500 runs and knocked in 1500 more (again only Gehrig and Foxx have matched it). Only first basemen in history with 400 home runs and 200 steals. He had almost nothing in his lineup other than Biggio. Ridiculous.

      I know a lot of writers said publicly they refused to vote for him the first year because he played in the steroid era, but if we assume everybody used steroids then that means we have to assume EVERYBODY used steroids, but I don't see Greg Maddux getting the steroid era treatment in two years.
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#15 Posted on 5.1.11 2139.19
Reposted on: 5.1.18 2139.40
I'll be fine with Bagwell getting in but Martinez was a modern day Ted Williams in the sense that he was a hitting MACHINE.

Interesting you mentioned Maddux though. You'd think pitching through the steroid era would help him be unanimous.
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#16 Posted on 5.1.11 2248.59
Reposted on: 5.1.18 2251.33

anecdotally, it seems like more pitchers have been suspended for PED use than everyday players.
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#17 Posted on 6.1.11 1226.27
Reposted on: 6.1.18 1228.10
Anybody catch Bob Costas just losing his shit when they were talking about Gonzales? Saying first that the steroid era is tainted and that you can't compare eras. Then he went on a tirade about Ted Williams having a lower slugging percentage than Gonzalez, and Ted Williams should be compared to anybody. Then he disgustedly proclaimed "that's why I will NEVER got for Gonzalez ".


He's such a tool and in love with any player who retired before the 70s started and can't comprehend that there are better athletes now than in the 40s or 50s.
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#18 Posted on 6.1.11 1302.55
Reposted on: 6.1.18 1304.07
    Originally posted by StaggerLee
    Anybody catch Bob Costas just losing his shit when they were talking about Gonzales? Saying first that the steroid era is tainted and that you can't compare eras. Then he went on a tirade about Ted Williams having a lower slugging percentage than Gonzalez, and Ted Williams should be compared to anybody. Then he disgustedly proclaimed "that's why I will NEVER got for Gonzalez ".


    He's such a tool and in love with any player who retired before the 70s started and can't comprehend that there are better athletes now than in the 40s or 50s.

The ironic thing for me is that the same people also will not consider the usefulness of more advanced sabermetric ways of looking at the game, even though they support their arguments far better than traditional stats.

For instance (all-time rank):
Adjusted batting runs: Williams 3rd, Gonzalez 135th
Adjusted batting wins: Williams 4th, Gonzalez 155th
Offensive win %: Williams 2nd, Gonzalez 325th
OPS+: Williams 2nd, Gonzalez 135th

odessasteps
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#19 Posted on 6.1.11 1637.39
Reposted on: 6.1.18 1638.27

Poz on the silliness of HOF exclusionary practices:

http://joeposnanski.blogspot.com/2011/01/willie-mays-hall-of-fame.html
supersalvadoran
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#20 Posted on 6.1.11 1838.40
Reposted on: 6.1.18 1839.34
    Originally posted by El Nastio
    I'll be fine with Bagwell getting in but Martinez was a modern day Ted Williams in the sense that he was a hitting MACHINE.




Except he doesn't compare with Williams at all. In fact, according to his Baseball-reference page (baseball-reference.com), he doesn't compare to any hofer in the 'similar scores' category.

Edgar Martinez was a good player, a really good player. But not a Hall of Famer. If you think he deserves to get in, then you must allow guys like Bagwell, Gonzalez, Palmeiro, Murphy, and even Albert freaking Belle in before him. Hell, he's barely even in my top 3 players named Martinez who deserve to get in (#1 is Pedro, #2 is Dennis, and Edgar just beats out Ramon).
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