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30.7.07 2046
The 7 - Current Events & Politics - Should We Rebuild The Twin Towers?
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PandaMask
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#21 Posted on 31.5.02 1521.21
Reposted on: 31.5.09 1529.03

    Originally posted by Sean
    Here's an example:

    Cheeseburgers are not kosher. Orthodox Jews in Israel do not want McDonald's to serve cheeseburgers. Secular Jews in Israel like and purchase cheeseburgers.

    Question: Do McDonald's in Israel sell cheeseburgers?


You're damn right they will, because anywhere there's a profit, there will be a McDonalds.


But either way, McDonalds kills thousands of civilians with saturated fat, cholesterol, grease, and hydrogenated oils.


And I'm sure that, yes, plenty of women are pleased that their countries are being westernized, and they don't have to wear clothing over every inch of their body. But this also goes far beyond this. The U.S. put so many people in power that were anti-communism in the 1950s that we didn't pay attention to the fact that they were extremists. If they ain't red, they can't be all that bad right? Well, now we've gotta go into our own tunnels we helped the Taliban build to fight the Russians (again, anti-communism) in the 80s. We put the Taliban in power, and how well did that work out?


But like I said, neither side will get anywhere killing civilians. So what then is the point?

Papercuts!
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#22 Posted on 31.5.02 1534.08
Reposted on: 31.5.09 1538.14
Yay! Now I'll know for CERTAIN which posts to ignore. Thank you so much. Seriously. Your horrible color scheme and background CLEARLY set you apart from the rest of the wienerville populace.

Because they don't get any more gawdawful than what you've got there, sonny jim.
PandaMask
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#23 Posted on 31.5.02 1604.36
Reposted on: 31.5.09 1605.36
Can I quote you on that??


And you know I do it all for you guys who sound like Comic Shop Guy every time you post. Crybaby.

Tha Puerto Rican
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#24 Posted on 31.5.02 1903.27
Reposted on: 31.5.09 1907.05

    Originally posted by PalpatineW
    50 empty floors... in a skyscraper? That's like asking someone to build a 50 story building and leave it empty, just as a memorial. The whole concept of the memorial is overrated. People die, horribly, all the time. Instead of whining and moaning, we should make sure it never happens again. I don't mean to belittle anyone's grief, I just think that a memorial of that scope isn't called for.

    Try telling that to the victim's families.
evilwaldo
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#25 Posted on 31.5.02 2011.50
Reposted on: 31.5.09 2029.02
They should rebuild but please not the ugly design that was there before. The whole complex stuck out like a sore thumb in the neighborhood.

That said, going home is weird now because I used to use the towers as a marker from the train to see where Manhattan ended.

Edit: Unfortunately, whatever is built will piss off a ton of people because it is only being built to satisfy some political friends. The whole cleanup process has been a disgrace so far.



(edited by evilwaldo on 31.5.02 2113)
Tha Puerto Rican
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#26 Posted on 31.5.02 2043.05
Reposted on: 31.5.09 2045.13

    Originally posted by evilwaldo
    They should rebuild but please not the ugly design that was there before. The whole complex stuck out like a sore thumb in the neighborhood.

    That said, going home is weird now because I used to use the towers as a marker from the train to see where Manhattan ended.

    Edit: Unfortunately, whatever is built will piss off a ton of people because it is only being built to satisfy some political friends. The whole cleanup process has been a disgrace so far.



    (edited by evilwaldo on 31.5.02 2113)



How has the cleanup been a disgrace? And yes, whatever happens, it will pissed off a lot of people including the people who say we shouldn't do anything with the site since it is "Sacred Ground". Why just build the Twin Towers in another part of lower Manhattan close by?
evilwaldo
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#27 Posted on 31.5.02 2131.40
Reposted on: 31.5.09 2159.01
The cleanup process has been a disgrace because everything is being done out of political considerations and greed. Guliani only wanted to extend his term so that he could dole out the cleanup contracts to his political donors. Not only that but look at the lack of cleanup effort going on in the apartments in the surrounding area. How about the firefighters that looted the shops in the concourse? Remember the riots with the firefighters and the police when the firefighters hours at ground zero were cut back? Within the next year a good portion of the policemen and firefighters will retire from public service because their pensions are based upon their last years salary, overtime included. Do you think they will ever earn this much again?

Lower Manhattan is difficult to build upon because it was once a landfill and very close to the ocean. They had to build 7 foot thick retaining walls to keep the ground from collapsing.

I just hope that whatever is built is astatically pleasing to the surrounding neighborhood and does not stand out like the twin towers did.
PalpatineW
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#28 Posted on 31.5.02 2237.11
Reposted on: 31.5.09 2238.44

    Originally posted by Tha Puerto Rican

    <

    Try telling that to the victim's families.



OK.

Every time someone suffers, do we need, PUBLICLY, to build a huge monument to them? Bad shit happens, dude. If we built a monument for every atrocity, big and small, we'd be a country with nothing but gravestones and memorials everywhere. I don't disrespect these peoples' sadness, but the center of Manhattan does not belong to the victims. I think it belongs to the living. If I die in a car crash in a busy intersection, should my family then demand that the state close the intersection and replace it with a giant statue of me? By your logic, the should.
MoeGates
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#29 Posted on 1.6.02 0836.25
Reposted on: 1.6.09 0837.10
Why just build the Twin Towers in another part of lower Manhattan close by?

Where in lower Manhattan do you propose to build such towers? On top of some other 70 story tower? Because thatīs pretty much all there is down there.
On the other hand, I guess they could just raise a few square blocks like they did to build the first WTC.

I just hope that whatever is built is astatically pleasing to the surrounding neighborhood and does not stand out like the twin towers did.

to the surrounding neighborhood? Lower manhattan isnīt exactly a quaint little fishing village where big buildings are all of a sudden being built. Itīs the home of big-ass buildings. Other big-ass buildings (inclusing two 1000 foot high towers) fit in better there than any other place in America, and possibly the world. I understand people live down there now, but really, they moved in knowing it was the countries larget business and financial center. If they want a "neighborhood" thereīs a million other places in the five boroughs to live. I have no sympathy for people who live in large commercial districts complaining about noise, big buildings, traffic, or anything else thatīs suppose to exist in commercial districts.
ges7184
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#30 Posted on 6.6.02 1626.40
Reposted on: 6.6.09 1629.04
Wars that kill civilians never work. I mean, we all know how bad that war against Germany and Japan in the 1940's turned out! Accomplished nothing, as we still have to deal with the world threat that is the evil emperor in Japan and Nazi Germany to this day..........oh, wait a minute....maybe not.

And before someone says they've been replaced by other threats, these guys were a much bigger threat than the terrorists could ever hope to be. The world is a safer place now than it was then.
Freeway
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#31 Posted on 6.6.02 1844.02
Reposted on: 6.6.09 1858.30
This whole thing is turning out like a campy after-school special... It all seems eerie because my buddy Nigel & I did a school project last summer...on TERRORISM. In campy 1950s fashion. I feel all creepy now...

So, the Americans tried to stamp out the evil pinko Commie bastards by funding anybody who wanted to take 'em out (Taliban, South Vietnamese, etc) and they unknowingly funded the same terrorist cells that they're fighting right now, simply because of the short-sightedness of the governments... So now the American/British/Canadian militaries are fighting terrorist cells with slightly less-advanced training and the old weapons, while theoretically the Allied Trio's troops have state-of-the-art weapons and training...

The fact is that the US shouldn't just build new towers 'cause they can, because that'd be stupid, same with doing it because others say they should. If you build new towers, just do it for New York, not for anybody else.
eviljonhunt81
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#32 Posted on 7.6.02 0215.55
Reposted on: 7.6.09 0218.04
While I never claimed that War shouldn't kill civilians, I think it is hypocritical to end up killing more civilians while removing a regime that was funded by you in an attempt to get back at a 3rd party that killed civilians.
PalpatineW
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#33 Posted on 7.6.02 1259.54
Reposted on: 7.6.09 1301.52
This isn't the schoolyard. We're not trying to "get back" at anyone. We're trying to *remove a threat.* It's not about one-upping the terrorists, it's about killing them before they kill any more of us. I don't buy any of this justice without revenge crap. We're simply trying to kill some people before they kill us.
eviljonhunt81
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#34 Posted on 7.6.02 1658.09
Reposted on: 7.6.09 1659.02
When did we decide that the Taliban, let alone civilians living in Afghanistan, were a threat to us? Yes, Al Queda members were living there, but we didn't overthrow the government of Indonesia because of terrorists there. We didn't overthrow the Saudi royal family because they have been essentially paying off terrorist groups for years.
Fuzzy Logic
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#35 Posted on 8.6.02 0225.11
Reposted on: 8.6.09 0226.13
afganistan is also a way to get oil from certain places in mid eurasia, without having to go through current mother russia.
Tom Dean
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#36 Posted on 8.6.02 1606.28
Reposted on: 8.6.09 1606.54
Well, people here didn't seem to think the Puerto Rican's idea of building an equally tall tower with lots of empty space on top was sensible, but apparently that's one of the things on the table.
The Masked Hungarian
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#37 Posted on 10.6.02 0141.52
Reposted on: 10.6.09 0143.45
My Two Cents:

NYC is massivly in debt. Businesses left for Jersey. It would be a crime NOT to rebuild the towers. You want a memorial? Engrave the names of the dead on the base of the buildings or on a Wall a la the Vietnam Memorial. That way everyone is happy. Ground Zero is not holy ground. It is the site of a terrorist act.

I'm all in favor of going into Iraq and finally getting rid of Hussein. If we're serious about extinguishing terrorism might as well get one of the head guys.

In response to Evil Waldo.

Guiliani was the BEST mayor this city ever had and I'm not saying this post 911. I'm saying that as a guy who voted for him three times. Quality of life greatly improved throughout the city, no Dinkins race riots and business was booming. I wish he could have stayed on for another term. Now, slowly but surely the porn/hookers/homeless are coming back into the city. Although hopefully Bloomberg will be able to turn our schools around now.

First of all, there was no RIOT between the PD and FD. It was a very heated situation incredibly blown up by the media. Second, I never heard of any firefighters looting the stores. Please fill me in on the details. Finally, how is it disgracful that these men and women who did their jobs honorably will have a chance to retire?
MoeGates
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#38 Posted on 10.6.02 0644.53
Reposted on: 10.6.09 0646.49
While life certainly did get better under Guiliani, Ed Koch is the mayor who did the most with least to work with (at least until his third term, when he slowly started going crazy).

While itīs impossible to know how much influence Guiliani had vs. how much credit is due to Clinton, the Economy, Demograpics, etc, I will make three points:

1. Guiliani inherited a declining crime rate
2. Guiliani benefited from a massive wave of immigration, & the best national economy (and the low crime and higher quality of life that comes with it) this century
3. Guiliani didnīt leave the city shit except a massive amount of debt and a lot of short term gain at long-term expense (hey, letīs sell everything we own and then pay the people we sold it to to rent it back to us! And while weīre at it, how about special long-term corporate tax breaks for everyone during the best economy of the century? Thatīs the ticket!). Ed Koch left the city with a lot of very needed long-term projects in the works (The Manhattan and Williamsburg bridges would have probably collapsed by now if it wasnīt for Koch), a fixed subway system, huge structural improvements, and some much-needed fiscal sanity, which Rudy has completely blown.

At least Bloomberg seems to not be completely cowed by business interestsī threats (probably because as a businessman himself he recognizes the bluffs), and isnīt going for any obvious bullshit like the New York Stock Exchange leaving the city.

Ed Koch, despite all his flaws and his huge ego, loved the city more than himself, and cared more about improving the city than improving his image. Iīm not going to say Rudy doesnīt love New York, because he obviously does, but he was certainly put his image and his legacy above the long-term health of the city.
The Masked Hungarian
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#39 Posted on 10.6.02 1328.34
Reposted on: 10.6.09 1329.04
Koch was a kick ass mayor, but I just really appreciated how Guiliani cleaned up the city. It's the little things that lead to a better quality of life and Rudy knew what those things were. I mean who ever thought Times Square could be a place to bring the family???
Stephanie
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#40 Posted on 11.6.02 0231.32
Reposted on: 11.6.09 0233.12

    Originally posted by T.R.
    Well, people here didn't seem to think the Puerto Rican's idea of building an equally tall tower with lots of empty space on top was sensible, but apparently that's one of the things on the table.


But who is going to pay for 350 feet of unprofitable glass on top of an office tower - space that needs to be maintained and protected (especially from airborne traffic, which may not see the transparent section until it's too late), but which won't earn a dime?

Steph
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