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The 7 - Current Events & Politics - Hamas Wins in Landslide Election in Palestine Register and log in to post!
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Stilton
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#1 Posted on 27.1.06 0846.30
Reposted on: 27.1.13 0846.33
The terrorist organization Hamas (news.yahoo.com) wins in a landslide victory (cnn.com) over the Fatah Party in Palestine.

The good news is, this is the first time in over 14 months that the word "landslide" has been used in the news without referring to a village being buried under a million tons of dirt.

The bad news is, Hamas does not have an exemplary track record in the foreign affairs department.

Some see this as a step backward in the peace process. Some have said that being forced to deal with the outside world will cause Hamas to open its eyes and start acting like a grown-up. I guess only time will tell.

In an interesting parallel. Both Palestine and Canada this week have voted against incumbent governments accused of corruption in favor of ultra right-wing extremist organizations. Could be a trend worth watching.
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JoshMann
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#2 Posted on 27.1.06 0905.15
Reposted on: 27.1.13 0906.46

    In an interesting parallel. Both Palestine and Canada this week have voted against incumbent governments accused of corruption in favor of ultra right-wing extremist organizations. Could be a trend worth watching.


"It could mean that, that point in time inherently contains some sort of cosmic significance. Almost as if it were the junction point for the entire space-time continuum. On the other hand, it could just be an amazing coincidence."
-Doc Brown
AWArulz
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#3 Posted on 27.1.06 0912.13
Reposted on: 27.1.13 0913.05
I guess here's the question I have; Now that Hamas is (essentially) the government, will their terrorist activities be considered the activities of the Palestinian state (such as it is), as opposed to the activities of a fringe group?

Hamas' charter is dedicated to the elimination of Israel, right?

What does this say about the Palestinian people? How will Hamas rule? My impression is still that the best treated most free Arabs are Israelis. I think Hamas being the ruling "party" will be a disaster.

But I was sure glad to see the vote and what a true democratic election told me about Palestine. What I already knew.

And I know nothing about Canadian Politics (and don't want to), but I have trouble with your seemingly equality statements about Hamas and the Canadian conservative party. Are the Conservatives dedicated to the elimination of the United States (or even Greenland?). I doubt it. Have the conservatives been sending Homicide Bombers up to Sudbury? No. I bet (and let's face it, I don't know), they are just a little more socially conservatives, and maybe fiscally more conservative than some of the other parties in Canada. People, especially as they age, long for a return to a more simple time.
The Goon
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#4 Posted on 27.1.06 0924.28
Reposted on: 27.1.13 0926.34
    Originally posted by Stilton
    In an interesting parallel. Both Palestine and Canada this week have voted against incumbent governments accused of corruption in favor of ultra right-wing extremist organizations.


Oh, for crying out loud...
DrDirt
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#5 Posted on 27.1.06 0938.10
Reposted on: 27.1.13 0938.55
Or maybe ladies and gentlemen, after decades of this conflict, they voted for the one group that was effective at helping them live. Hamas is what it is but they look honest and effective compared to Fatah.

And if we are objective, Israel's actions helped push them to Hamas. I hope this will force Hamas to moderate and scare Israel a bit and that the can meet in the middle.
spf
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#6 Posted on 27.1.06 0940.17
Reposted on: 27.1.13 0940.28
    Originally posted by AWArulz
    I guess here's the question I have; Now that Hamas is (essentially) the government, will their terrorist activities be considered the activities of the Palestinian state (such as it is), as opposed to the activities of a fringe group?

    Hamas' charter is dedicated to the elimination of Israel, right?

    What does this say about the Palestinian people? How will Hamas rule? My impression is still that the best treated most free Arabs are Israelis. I think Hamas being the ruling "party" will be a disaster.

    But I was sure glad to see the vote and what a true democratic election told me about Palestine. What I already knew.

What it said about Palestine was "we have two choices. A group that is basically the social infrastructure in most places, providing food and clothing and education, or a distant bloated corrupt group that shows no concern for our needs and trades on nothing but memories of the past." For most of these people, I would venture they were voting for Hamas as the people who they see on a daily basis, not the folks who comprise the armed wing of the party. Also, the idea that Fatah was not linked to any sort of terror is total bunk that we accept simply to give Abbas legitimacy. Al Aqsa is still tied to them. There are no clean hands there. As I said in the thread that got moved to the inability to distinguish between Iraq and Palestine, I am hopeful for Hamas to take a path like Sinn Fein, moving to a legitimacy based on political strength. Which seems from everything I've seen out of Palestine to me what the voters want them to do, as everyone they've talked to has basically said they are tired of war, which I believe. It's done nothing for them. Much like Fatah.
CRZ
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#7 Posted on 27.1.06 1015.29
Reposted on: 27.1.13 1015.37
    Originally posted by Stilton
    Both Palestine and Canada this week have voted against incumbent governments accused of corruption in favor of ultra right-wing extremist organizations. Could be a trend worth watching.
Your recent posts are a trend worth avoiding. Please take your political kookery elsewhere as I am officially tired of seeing it here.
cfgb
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#8 Posted on 27.1.06 1109.52
Reposted on: 27.1.13 1110.25
Both Palestine and Canada this week have voted against incumbent governments accused of corruption in favor of ultra right-wing extremist organizations.

Getting off the topic of Palestine, I don't appreciate that at all.

I voted for the Conservatives myself, and I don't consider myself to be ultra right-wing. In fact, I sit in the middle.

Extremists? I don't get the feeling I'm going to be reciting prayers at work. I don't really think they're going to be declaring war on people who disagree with their values.

I'll tell you why I voted Conservative. Our Liberals who run the country have gotten lazy and complacent. They did many wonderful things in the early years, under Jean Chretien's leadership and Paul Martin's brilliant budget planning. Unfortunately, in recent years, they've lost sight of what they wanted to do with the country - and Martin is not leadership material. He had to go.

From all the platforms, in my opinion, Gilles Duceppes of the Bloc Quebecois made the most sense for our country based on the party values, in my opinion. This does not make me a seperatist, because I am a hardcore pro-Canadian who will not support Federalism. But the BQ certainly has a lot of other things going for them - and if they were able to adopt those to a national party, I would be in their corner.

But I live in Ontario, which left me with the Conservative Party. Say what you will about Steven Harper, and a lot has and will be said, but he's a leader. He was born a leader, takes a stand, and sticks by it. Like all politicians, there's enough BS that runs out of his mouth - but we have to accept that none of these folks is ever going to be straight edged. Regardless of that, I am comfortable with him leading our country, and with the Conservatives in the minority, they will be kept under control from doing anything harmful over the long run. First misstep - and we've got another election on our hands.

Comparing that to Middle Eastern third world terrorism is sickening.
Jaguar
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#9 Posted on 27.1.06 1651.37
Reposted on: 27.1.13 1651.47
    Originally posted by AWArulz
    But I was sure glad to see the vote and what a true democratic election told me about Palestine. What I already knew.


I'm rather curious to know what it was you already knew about Palestine that the election of Hamas confirms?
AWArulz
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#10 Posted on 27.1.06 1655.01
Reposted on: 27.1.13 1655.06
    Originally posted by Jaguar
      Originally posted by AWArulz
      But I was sure glad to see the vote and what a true democratic election told me about Palestine. What I already knew.


    I'm rather curious to know what it was you already knew about Palestine that the election of Hamas confirms?


That the majority of Palestinians were OK with terrorism as a policy. I recognize that Fatah was also involved with Terrorism, but had somewhat renouced it. Hamas had not and does not. And they won, apparently overwhelmingly. I'm not surprised by the results, frankly.

Jonny_English
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#11 Posted on 28.1.06 0624.03
Reposted on: 28.1.13 0624.19
    Originally posted by AWArulz
    That the majority of Palestinians were OK with terrorism as a policy.


While all you or I can do is speculate, I suggest that the captioned comment is a bit of a stretch. I consider it more likely that the "average" Palestinian Hamas supporter is no different than the "average" Sinn Fein supporter;

a) They consider their homeland to be unlawfully occupied;
b) They consider "terrorism" to be an armed struggle for their very freedom.

The test for me is whether Hamas, who I expect will do a far better job of maintaining the Palestinian infrastructure, can submit to a transparent process whereby they abandon armed conflict in favour of legitimate government.
skorpio17
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#12 Posted on 28.1.06 0722.35
Reposted on: 28.1.13 0726.50
The one thing now is that Israel is negotiating with the right people. It is clear that for years Hamas has been pulling the strings and controlling the Palestinian agenda. It was easy for the ruling Fatah party to play the good cop and say they were trying their best, but couldn't stop the terrorist activities of Hamas. At least now you are negotiating with the people who have the power to stop terrorism (if they wanted to).

The bigger question here is, "What's so great about democracy?" American policy has for years claimed democracy as a panacea in the middle east. Democracies would have free trade and would never declare war on each other. Now we've got them in Afganistan, Iraq, and Palestine and the theory doesn't hold up.

If the people are simply assholes who will elect more assholes, than why not just stay out of the Mideast and leave the dictators in charge.
MoeGates
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#13 Posted on 28.1.06 1402.46
Reposted on: 28.1.13 1402.51
The big question isn't whether or not Israel will negotiate with Hamas, it's whether Hamas will negotiate with Israel. Their whole party stand while out of power has basically been "we don't negotiate or talk to Israel." Now that they're in power, that's a somewhat unfeasable position. How they handle this is going to be interesting to watch.
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