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The 7 - Pro Wrestling - Latest episode of BTR: Bret Hart and Scott D'Amore
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The Vile1
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#1 Posted on 28.7.05 1242.47
Reposted on: 28.7.12 1244.04
http://www.betweentheropes.com/stream.php?filename=0727.wma

Latest episode of Between The Ropes. The hosts of the show pretty accurately sum up my current feelings on WWE and why I watch TNA. And you know what? They are right. Right now TNA IS producing the best weekly wrestling shows AND the best wrestling PPV's. Or at least better than WWE.

I think one notable thing to point out about the people who are currently booking TNA, is that they have primarily WRESTLING backgrounds. These are guys who grew up in the business or around it. Scott D'Amore former wrestler, a wrestling trainer, and manager. Mike Tenay, who is a wrestling historian and announcer. Jeremy Borash who used to work for WCW. These are NOT Hollywood sitcom and soap opera writers! The owners and people at the front office have given the creative power of TNA to the people that should have it.

Scott D'Amore said the best compliment he ever recieved was when people went up to him regarding TNA and said, "Your show doesn't make me ashamed to be a wrestling fan." And you know, if you guys have watched some WWE recently, that has a lot of resonance. The BTR hosts than added, "TNA doesn't insult our intelligence." D'Amore also said that no one can honestly say to him that the wrestling they tune into on Monday night or Thursday night is better than their show right now. Bold statement but I agree with him.

So I think it just speaks of how much TNA is doing right at the moment and that they can't falter, they need to stay on this hot streak they are currently on for as long as possible. October is most crucial because that's when they debut on Spike TV and have Bound For Glory. So it better be stacked.

Bret Hart recap (from NoDQ):


    Recap of Bret Hart on Between the Ropes:

    Bret talks about the NWA Legends Fanfest and says that any time that he can be around Dory Funk Junior, Terry Funk, or Harley Race, it is a special time for him and the fans. He knew them when he was fourteen and fifteen years old and has a close relationship with the Funks. He is close to them because they wrestled for his father’s promotion in the 1970s. When you are around those people with their histories, you need to remember that things would not be the same if not for them.

    He misses certain aspects of the business. He wishes that he could wrestle people like Kurt Angle, Chris Benoit, and Eddie Guerrero for the purpose of having matches with them. He does not miss being dropped on his head, the hotel rooms, and the car rentals. He did it for so long. The most fun he had was being in the ring. He had fun going out there to perform with the guy you were in there with and tell a story with the guy on the other side of the ring. He was at home in the ring and misses that. He would love to put a head lock on a person like Harley Race or Dory Funk Junior. You will never ‘not miss it’. You miss the camaraderie of your peers and performing.

    He does not watch the current product, and would rather put in a tape and watch some old matches. He talks about the Stampede Wrestling product. He talks about his match against Undertaker at SummerSlam 1997 and how wrestling had more credibility then because it was not as exposed and it does not look too rehearsed. He would rather see guys show some intensity in the ring. He thinks that over the last few years it is more about high spots and series of moves that they practiced instead of doing what wrestling is supposed to be. There are some great athletes now. He talked about watching a recent match between Kurt Angle and Rey Mysterio and said that it was a great match. He wishes that they would move more towards reality instead of the soap opera style. You are always going to find fans that enjoyed it more during their era. He would love to see more characters like Stone Cold where there was a flair of legitimacy in their characters.

    Bret would love to be able to pass on what he knows. He has been treated by the younger wrestlers with respect. He gets calls from people like Edge and Chris Benoit when they come to town. He thinks they value his opinion. He does not want to overstep his bounds by telling young wrestlers what works and does not. He thinks that some of those wrestlers know things better than him. He would not mind giving advice and feedback about things. He has talked to Scott D’Amore and others about being able to give back. Maybe he will be able to have a wrestling school where he can teach people what he thinks are the important things to learn about wrestling. Maybe it would be the psychology. Wrestlers need to know when to do the moves with some logic or reason behind the moves. There needs to be a story behind working a hold. The older wrestlers were able to tell a story by working a body part.

    Bret was asked if he would accept an on-air role. He would ‘never say never’. He admires the spunk of TNA and that they are trying to be a counter-product to the WWE. It is good to see that there is some competition and that is necessary for the business. He thinks the wrestlers are in a sorry state of affairs without competition. Talks with TNA have been left on hold for a while. He is waiting for the right opportunity. Going through what he has with the stroke, he wants to move away from the wrestling to get his priorities in line. He wants to deal with his children and his new wife. He does not want to worry about what he is going to say or having to deal with connecting flights.

    He does not know why the tag team division has been ignored by the WWE. Maybe it has to do with the teams that are there. There were some that stood out from the others. If you looked at the Road Warriors, they were money in the bank because they were so impressive looking. The British Bulldogs were like that too. The Hart Foundation had a unique combination. Maybe because of the looks of the wrestlers and the moves they can pull out. He would rather see a Hart Foundation/Rockers match instead of some of the things going on today. It is a shame what has happened to the tag teams. He talks about the gold soldered belt, which is one of the ugliest belts is now the most important belt while the belt he wore is not important any more. The WWF belt was a symbol to all wrestlers because of the history of the people who held the belt. The NWA belt also has a history to it. He does not know why the WCW belt is more important in the WWE because of that history. The WWF always tried to outdo WCW during his time with the WWF.

    Bret was asked if fences could be mended with the WWE. He would like to think that it could be rectified, but it does not look like it will be. He was proud of his work in the WWF because you could not sum up his career with the last few minutes in Montreal. He wrestled Ricky Steamboat, the British Bulldogs, Ted DiBiase, and Curt Hennig. He would love to see that history restored. He does not want it to be lost or displaced. He talked to Vince that he wanted to be credited for what he contributed. However, he does not know if they would own up to what they did and find a reasonable way for him to be a part of the Hall of Fame or a DVD to showcase his career. He has not seen anything to indicate that they will do something. It looks like they would rather exploit things by having both sides say what happened. His behavior during that time was very difficult for him and he has never made light of it. He took pride of his work at that time and never had any regrets. The WWE should be willing to come forward and say that they did not handle business well and that there was some clouded vision, he would be willing to be a part of the Hall of Fame.

    Bret was asked about the rumored DVD about the Montreal incident. He does not want to make light of Montreal anymore. It is like a scab and he does not want to deal with it anymore. He does not beat himself over the head that he was not at Kemper Arena when Owen passed. People were affected by what happened, and people see it as a black eye for the WWF. They did their story where Shawn admitted to being involved. They say that it was just business, but Bret does not feel that it was just business. He wishes it did not happen. He always told himself that Vince was confident that Bret would be back, sooner or later. Bret wishes that he could go back, but he does not see a way he can go back without losing face. He is not greedy for money, he wants the respect. He hopes that there can be something that will allow Bret to be remembered for what he did in the WWF.

    Bret says that he had zero input in his character in WCW. Whenever he gave any input, it was ignored. Everyone in charge of the booking in WCW could be given ideas, but they would be shot down or they would come back with an idea that made no sense. The only thing that he did was the ‘steel plate’ angle with Bill Goldberg. WCW tried to do everything possible to screw that angle up. They wanted to ruin the idea. The other thing was the match with Chris Benoit in Kansas City as a tribute to Owen. WCW never listened to anything else he said. Most of the thing that he did made no sense to him or probably to his fans. He does not know if there was any jealousy over what he was making, but maybe there were some people there who had it in for him. He says that some suggested to him that it was Hogan, Flair, Kevin Sullivan, or Kevin Nash, but he did not know. He had a good rapport with Eric Bischoff, but it seemed like he was dealing with people who wanted to keep him on the bench.

    His life has been sidetracked by his brother Owen’s passing, his stroke, his parent’s passing, as well as the passing of Davey Boy Smith. He has a new lease on life and he has a different perspective on life. He thought he would not be able to do many things after his stroke, but he has had a great recovery and has been able to do a lot of things that he was unable to do before. He has been able to sit back and appreciate what he has accomplished.

    His autobiography is still in the works and he has worked on his early career. As he worked on it, the closer he got to writing about Owen or Montreal; it got more difficult to put the words down. When it comes out, it should satisfy everyone’s appetite to know what it was like to be a wrestler during his time in the business. His current priorities are his new wife and kids. The book will come out in due time.



So I guess the DVD coming out in November is NOT the Bret Hart DVD we all want to see? From the sound of things its probably just going to be WWE's perspective on the whole thing, an anti Wrestling With Shadows or something.

Cool to see Bret Hart respects TNA, and doesn't rule out the possibility of ever making an on-air appearance with them or even WWE. If TNA could get him that would be an awesome thing unlike getting Macho Man, Hall, Nash, and DDP which were just wastes of time.
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#2 Posted on 28.7.05 1320.49
Reposted on: 28.7.12 1329.01
Hell, if Bret showed up just one time on WWE programming, it would be huge. Hopefully if the Bret Hart DVD is put out, he's actually on it. wouldn't make much sense otherwise.

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#3 Posted on 28.7.05 1351.43
Reposted on: 28.7.12 1353.57
If he didn't talk about TNA, I'd swear this is the same interview I've read about 10 different times since his stroke.
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#4 Posted on 28.7.05 1630.59
Reposted on: 28.7.12 1638.21
Wow, one of the performers for TNA says that his show is better than WWE? Colour me amazed. I don't know what kind of "hot streak" can be gleamed from having no TV show and PPV's that hardly get any buys. I sincerely hope that TNA does do well when they get on Spike TV, but I won't get my hopes up.

At the risk of sounding CRZ-like, I understand that you like TNA more than WWE, Vile1. You don't have to reiterate this in every thread in the Wrestling forum. I also hear that Spaceman Spiff thinks A-Train and Chuck Palumbo are underrated. In other news, the sun will come up tomorrow.
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#5 Posted on 28.7.05 1636.08
Reposted on: 28.7.12 1638.35
    Originally posted by Simba
    If he didn't talk about TNA, I'd swear this is the same interview I've read about 10 different times since his stroke.


Well that's what happens when the guy's been asked the exact same questions 10 different times.

It'd be nice if someone who knew what they were doing had a chance to interview him. Someone who did know all the answers that he's given year after year and could think of something interesting and original to ask him.

As far as Scott D'Amore goes, I've never seen him wrestle, but if it's the same Scott D'Amore that used to be on Off The Record a few times a year way back, he never came across as someone terribly intelligent.


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#6 Posted on 28.7.05 1900.13
Reposted on: 28.7.12 1900.14
    Originally posted by The Vile1

    He does not watch the current product, and would rather put in a tape and watch some old matches...........

    .......... He talked about watching a recent match between Kurt Angle and Rey Mysterio and said that it was a great match. He wishes that they would move more towards reality instead of the soap opera style.


Gees, I wish I could just randomly switch channels on my TV and have great matches appear! Can TiVo even do that? Das cool.
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#7 Posted on 28.7.05 1942.55
Reposted on: 28.7.12 1944.38
    Originally posted by Torchslasher
    Wow, one of the performers for TNA says that his show is better than WWE? Colour me amazed. I don't know what kind of "hot streak" can be gleamed from having no TV show and PPV's that hardly get any buys. I sincerely hope that TNA does do well when they get on Spike TV, but I won't get my hopes up.

    At the risk of sounding CRZ-like, I understand that you like TNA more than WWE, Vile1. You don't have to reiterate this in every thread in the Wrestling forum. I also hear that Spaceman Spiff thinks A-Train and Chuck Palumbo are underrated. In other news, the sun will come up tomorrow.


The way I see it, isn't it better that I reiterate something that I'm positive about instead of bitching and moaning about WWE so much?

(edited by The Vile1 on 28.7.05 2248)
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#8 Posted on 28.7.05 2031.11
Reposted on: 28.7.12 2032.46
    Originally posted by The Vile1
      Originally posted by Torchslasher
      Wow, one of the performers for TNA says that his show is better than WWE? Colour me amazed. I don't know what kind of "hot streak" can be gleamed from having no TV show and PPV's that hardly get any buys. I sincerely hope that TNA does do well when they get on Spike TV, but I won't get my hopes up.

      At the risk of sounding CRZ-like, I understand that you like TNA more than WWE, Vile1. You don't have to reiterate this in every thread in the Wrestling forum. I also hear that Spaceman Spiff thinks A-Train and Chuck Palumbo are underrated. In other news, the sun will come up tomorrow.


    The way I see it. Isn't it better that I reiterate something that I'm positive about instead of bitching and moaning about WWE so much?


No no no, from what I've read you're supposed to bitch and moan about the WWE and TNA and anything and everything else.
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#9 Posted on 29.7.05 0120.20
Reposted on: 29.7.12 0122.09
The thing I don't understand is why you watch WWE at all if you don't like "sportz entertainment"? You can harp on and on about how you dislike that there's no wrestling people writing the shows, and we all have, but I have a busload of AWA tapes, NWA tapes, USWA tapes, and none of it entertains me as much as WWF's stuff. I like the pyro and the ridiculous overblown hyperbole and wild characters, all things within reason of course.

I don't watch TNA for a variety of reasons. Lists are forbidden, so I will write short paragraphs on the top reasons.

1/ It looks cheap. Sorry, but I am not spending thirty bucks on something that looks like it was filmed at my old high school. Call it grassroots if you like, but the few times I got those weekly wednesday ppvs, I found the production values to be ridiculously bad. Would I watch it for free on television? Sure, but I don't get Fox Sports Net. I do get Spike, but will I stay home on a Saturday night to watch TNA? No, I don't think I will. Will I even make the effort to tape it? Again, I don't think so. I'm just completely uninterested.

2/I hate their fans. If you've got a bunch of people coming to your show more interested in getting their "witty" signs on camera and starting a "clever" chant than in cheering your faces and booing your heels and liking your product, I got news for ya: you fanbase is idiots. They go there jaded. They go there with the "impress me" attitude, instead of to have fun. The TNA crowd is the smarmiest crowd in wrestling today, and I always hated crowds that never wanted to get into the show. They're even worse than ECW crowds, who, while just as arrogant, at least seemed to understand on some level that they were all scumbags. TNA fans seem to be attempting in some weird way to rise to the dizzying stature of ECW fans. They're scumbag wannabes. I find that so pathetic it hurts.

3/I hate Mike Tenay. I've said this before. I simply cannot stand this man's voice. He is such a geek. He's creepy-lookin'. He strikes me as the kind of guy who the whole neighborhood loves, but has bodies in his basement. This may seem shallow, but unlike Michael Cole, who seems quite the nerd, Cole seems to be aware of it and seems to be able to play into it. Mike Tenay seems like he has no idea what a goofball he is. I don't considern him a great commentator because while he knows the names of all the moves and has background on all the guys, his nerdiness is so overwhelming that if anyone comes into the room while you're watching the show they immediately think of you as a nerd for liking something hosted by someone so nerdy.

No, just no.

4/ I hate Jeff Jarrett. I cannot get into this guy. I used to like him in WCW, when he was doing the chosen one gimmick. That was cute at the time, because he wasn't actually supposed to be the top guy. He was the sort of heel who was out of his league and didn't know it, and snuck it out at the last minute by cheating. Now, he's the Triple H of TNA. He actually supposed to be the best in the company, and thus, their world champ for how long? A year? He is a pure mid-card player, average in the ring, below average in appearance, and below average on the mic. If he's really the best they got, they'd have to pay me to see one of these stinkers.

5/ Ultimate X matches are lame. That is the most absurd, convoluted gimmick match I have ever seen in my life. It never fails to expose the workers, and requires more examples of "wrestling physics" than ten consecutive Sable Bombs. And it's embarrassing when the belt won't come off when the guy grabs it, but then comes off on its own.

I can't think of any more reasons, but I know I have some. I think it had to do with me still never having been impressed with A.J. Styles or Shawn Michaels' cousin or any of those other guys who were supposed to be the "future of the business". Am I supposed to spend eighty bucks before I catch one of these shmucks on the night where they live up to that bullshit hype?
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#10 Posted on 29.7.05 1539.12
Reposted on: 29.7.12 1540.13
    Originally posted by Hogan's My Dad
    The thing I don't understand is why you watch WWE at all if you don't like "sportz entertainment"? You can harp on and on about how you dislike that there's no wrestling people writing the shows, and we all have, but I have a busload of AWA tapes, NWA tapes, USWA tapes, and none of it entertains me as much as WWF's stuff. I like the pyro and the ridiculous overblown hyperbole and wild characters, all things within reason of course.


I don't watch WWE...at all.




    I don't watch TNA for a variety of reasons. Lists are forbidden, so I will write short paragraphs on the top reasons.

    1/ It looks cheap. Sorry, but I am not spending thirty bucks on something that looks like it was filmed at my old high school. Call it grassroots if you like, but the few times I got those weekly wednesday ppvs, I found the production values to be ridiculously bad. Would I watch it for free on television? Sure, but I don't get Fox Sports Net. I do get Spike, but will I stay home on a Saturday night to watch TNA? No, I don't think I will. Will I even make the effort to tape it? Again, I don't think so. I'm just completely uninterested.


I agree that the production sucks. But for me, the product in the ring makes up for it. WWE has great production values, but for me the product right now is unwatchable. For ECW One Night Stand, I found the good production values somewhat...wrong .




    2/I hate their fans. If you've got a bunch of people coming to your show more interested in getting their "witty" signs on camera and starting a "clever" chant than in cheering your faces and booing your heels and liking your product, I got news for ya: you fanbase is idiots. They go there jaded. They go there with the "impress me" attitude, instead of to have fun. The TNA crowd is the smarmiest crowd in wrestling today, and I always hated crowds that never wanted to get into the show. They're even worse than ECW crowds, who, while just as arrogant, at least seemed to understand on some level that they were all scumbags. TNA fans seem to be attempting in some weird way to rise to the dizzying stature of ECW fans. They're scumbag wannabes. I find that so pathetic it hurts.



So the fans annoy you. I find the chants unique and entertaining.





    3/I hate Mike Tenay. I've said this before. I simply cannot stand this man's voice. He is such a geek. He's creepy-lookin'. He strikes me as the kind of guy who the whole neighborhood loves, but has bodies in his basement. This may seem shallow, but unlike Michael Cole, who seems quite the nerd, Cole seems to be aware of it and seems to be able to play into it. Mike Tenay seems like he has no idea what a goofball he is. I don't considern him a great commentator because while he knows the names of all the moves and has background on all the guys, his nerdiness is so overwhelming that if anyone comes into the room while you're watching the show they immediately think of you as a nerd for liking something hosted by someone so nerdy.

    No, just no.



I hate Jim Ross and can't stand him anymore. Cole has grown more tolerable over the years, now even more tolerable than Jim Ross for me.

I think Mike Tenay is great and I'd rather listen to him then Ross and Cole at this point.





    4/ I hate Jeff Jarrett. I cannot get into this guy. I used to like him in WCW, when he was doing the chosen one gimmick. That was cute at the time, because he wasn't actually supposed to be the top guy. He was the sort of heel who was out of his league and didn't know it, and snuck it out at the last minute by cheating. Now, he's the Triple H of TNA. He actually supposed to be the best in the company, and thus, their world champ for how long? A year? He is a pure mid-card player, average in the ring, below average in appearance, and below average on the mic. If he's really the best they got, they'd have to pay me to see one of these stinkers.


I agree. I hate Jeff Jarrett as well. And TNA is NOT going to go anywhere if they keep focusing on him. Jarrett has to be willing to step aside for a while if TNA is to ever truly grow and develop.





    5/ Ultimate X matches are lame. That is the most absurd, convoluted gimmick match I have ever seen in my life. It never fails to expose the workers, and requires more examples of "wrestling physics" than ten consecutive Sable Bombs. And it's embarrassing when the belt won't come off when the guy grabs it, but then comes off on its own.

    I can't think of any more reasons, but I know I have some. I think it had to do with me still never having been impressed with A.J. Styles or Shawn Michaels' cousin or any of those other guys who were supposed to be the "future of the business". Am I supposed to spend eighty bucks before I catch one of these shmucks on the night where they live up to that bullshit hype?


I've seen just about all the Ultimate X matches, and the only time that happened was the first one. And it was still a great match. To me, an Ultimate X match is just a ladder match without the ladder, and I don't find that convoluted at all.

All I can tell you is, I haven't spent eighty bucks to see Styles and Shane live up to that "bullshit", which I think they have. So I guess that's where we differ.
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#11 Posted on 30.7.05 1035.27
Reposted on: 30.7.12 1036.04
"I don't watch WWE...at all."

In that case, can you PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE stop popping into threads about the WWE product to tell us just how much it sucks and how TNA is ever so much better? From the results I read online I think TNA's booking is pure crap, but I keep my trap shut in threads on the subject because I haven't actually seen it.
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#12 Posted on 30.7.05 1105.41
Reposted on: 30.7.12 1106.16
    Originally posted by Hogan's My Dad
    I hate their fans. If you've got a bunch of people coming to your show more interested in getting their "witty" signs on camera and starting a "clever" chant than in cheering your faces and booing your heels and liking your product, I got news for ya: you fanbase is idiots. They go there jaded. They go there with the "impress me" attitude, instead of to have fun. The TNA crowd is the smarmiest crowd in wrestling today, and I always hated crowds that never wanted to get into the show. They're even worse than ECW crowds, who, while just as arrogant, at least seemed to understand on some level that they were all scumbags. TNA fans seem to be attempting in some weird way to rise to the dizzying stature of ECW fans. They're scumbag wannabes. I find that so pathetic it hurts.


Ummm...didn't the above just sum-up 1. IWC as a whole, 2. Those that attend ANY live wrestling event today, and 3. A good percentage of the people who post on this board? I dunno. :/
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#13 Posted on 30.7.05 1342.41
Reposted on: 30.7.12 1343.59
    Originally posted by oldschoolhero
    "I don't watch WWE...at all."

    In that case, can you PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE stop popping into threads about the WWE product to tell us just how much it sucks and how TNA is ever so much better? From the results I read online I think TNA's booking is pure crap, but I keep my trap shut in threads on the subject because I haven't actually seen it.


Well its either, "if you don't like it, don't watch it" or "you can't say anything about it if you don't watch it."

There have been times where I just totally stopped watching WWE before, and in this case, I've found something else that's better instead. So I mean, I don't understand the problem with that. Should I only be bitching about how much WWE sucks?

I'm not the only one who seems to have the same problems with WWE right now, and I think the BTR link above is symbolic of that.
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#14 Posted on 31.7.05 1245.49
Reposted on: 31.7.12 1246.49
The issue is that you say you don't watch WWE at all, and yet you continually comment, in detail, on things that they're doing wrong. With your new-found love for TNA I doubt that you'd take kindly to people extending them that kind of treatment, and it's a little grating to read your anti-WWE, pro-TNA posts when you yourself admit that you don't even watch the specific product that you're attacking. Frankly, you come across as a shill.
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