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21.8.07 1912
The 7 - Pro Wrestling - Vengeance Thoughts
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Juggalo101
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#1 Posted on 26.6.05 2219.34
Reposted on: 26.6.12 2226.12
30 minutes after Vengeance and no thread?
Hmmmm....

-Entertaining show, but nothing memorable. As far as Hell in the Cell's go, third from the bottom up in front of Trips/Nash and Bossman/Taker. It had its moments, but still all in all you got the same match out of every HHH Hell in a Cell match. Please, somebody find a new way to utilize the cage in the match.

-Michaels/Angle = Nice rematch, but a lot of the same of that we've seen.

-Cena's sloppiness in the ring downgraded the triple threat for me a bit, but still not a bad match.

-This night was basically a night of non-originality and that's what hurt this PPV. Not a bad show, but all in all it was the same Hell in the Cell match we've seen the past couple of years, the same HBK/Angle match we saw at Wrestlemania, and the same triple threat format of only two guys in the ring at a time. Give me something new please...
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TheMASKEDComputerGeek
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#2 Posted on 26.6.05 2221.13
Reposted on: 26.6.12 2226.13
Other than working on the back, I don't think that HBK/Angle was overly similar except when they had spots that were meant to harken back to the first matchup (the attempted Angle Slam into the ringpost, for instance). That was another great match.
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#3 Posted on 26.6.05 2232.04
Reposted on: 26.6.12 2232.07
I found the Michaels/Angle match to be underwelming, and i felt it to be far below their WM matchup as far as quality/drama go.

The triple threat was good in my view, and definitely better than I expected. And the Hell in a Cell was very good in my eyes, and I thought that the style of the match played to Batista's strengths. All in all a very good show.
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#4 Posted on 26.6.05 2300.17
Reposted on: 26.6.12 2300.42
Live from a movie theater, it's my Vengeance thoughts:

World Tag Team Champions The Hurricane & Rosey (with Stacy Keibler) beat The Heart Throbs (Romeo & Antonio) on HEAT
-WWE, PLEASE find a way to differentiate the Heart Throbs. Something. Blah match. Nice near-fall at the end after the Throbs hit their Double STO. *3/4

WWE Intercontinental Champion Carlito beat Shelton Benjamin
-The psychology of the match worked well. Shelton sold the head and Carlito went after him. Good showcase for resilient babyface Benjamin getting cheated. On the downside, Carlito's entire offense was punches and body slams. I would've liked to have seen Carlito hit a finisher after Benjamin hit the turnbuckle bolt, since now Carlito seems like a fluke champion. ***

Victoria beat Christy
-Nice subtle heel remix of Victoria's music, similar to the heelish tint in Eddy Guerrero's lately. Weak match, but at least it was short. I'm not sure if it was meant to make Christy stronger or Victoria weaker, but I think it ended up doing a little of both. 3/4*

Kane beat Edge (with Lita)
-Ah, WWE main event style. Lots of punching and fakey stuff with finishers. The Snitsky run-in made sense, and led into a nice flurry for the finish. That said, the action beforehand was monotonous. **1/2

Kurt Angle beat Shawn Michaels
-Excellent match, lots of call-backs to the original. The headlock spot, the outside attempted Angle Slam spot, and the Ankle Lock spots all meshed well with the new stuff (like the finish, swiping the same manuever from the Benjamin/Michaels match a few weeks hence). Also suiting that after the referee had bitched at Angle for various reasons, Angle ends up (accidentally) taking him out. ****1/2 Not sure if it was as good as Mania, but close.

The Godfather & Viscera (with various ladies of the night) beat the Institution of Marriage (with Lillian Garcia)
-Lillian played her part well. So did Vis. The Godfather's return was a nice surprise. I especially liked the end with Viscera on the ramp saying "I'm sorry" to a tearful Lillian. I'm sorry, but how does this lead to wrestling? This was a fun angle and gave these folks something to do...but where's the wrestling?? I DO hope, however, that the Godfather's return leads to Supply & Demand 2 (with Viscera) to fill out the tag ranks.

WWE Champion John Cena beat Christian (by his damn self) & Chris Jericho
-Nice work by Hebner tossing Tomko early. I have to say this was the biggest surprise of the card, as everything clicked rather well. Christian & Jericho did most of the work, but Cena didn't do anything glaringly bad. That said, there was the usual WWE "two at a time" policy...which, of course, was violated with the fantastic Cena powerbombing Jericho while Jericho superplexed Christian spot. ***3/4

World Champion Batista beat Triple H (by his damn self) inside the dreaded Hell In A Cell
-Probably the best of the HHH/Batista series. Nice use of toys and blood, but as expected there was a crapload of punchy/kicky. But where do we go from here? ***1/2

Good show by my count. Everything that was good was good, and everything that sucked was kept to a minimum.

(edited by Freeway420 on 26.6.05 2200)
Packman V2
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#5 Posted on 26.6.05 2305.42
Reposted on: 26.6.12 2307.16
No major gripes, the Benjamin/Carlito rematch was good to kick things off, and could be the start of a good feud provided Benjamin remains on Raw. I didn't even have any real gripes with the Christy/Victoria match. For a women's match, it was probably one of the most entertaining ones I've seen, but Christy does need to dial down the endless screaming...my ears need the break.

I'm sure I'm not the only one hoping for a Matt Hardy run in during the Kane/Edge match, but even though it didn't happen, they could have done something where Kane set up the theme to play to catch Edge offguard. As much as she tries to play it off, Lita did turn around to the crowd during one of the "you screwed Matt" chants...crowd was extremely loud, probably a result of the Hardy entrance played on Raw.

Angle & HBK was the best match of the night IMO, and wasn't disappointing to me at all, except the final SCM from the top rope, which didn't make a lot of sense, since the only time I can think of Angle goin up is for the moonsault, but even then, a great rematch, and probably setting the stage for a third and final match to end it once and for all at say Summerslam?? I am so glad Angle is on Raw now...best draft pick so far.

Triple Threat had me stumped at first, I really didn't know who was gonna take the gold, and thought all three had a chance at one point during the match. Nice finish with the F-U, but I had kinda hoped it would go longer.

HIAC, what can I say, HHH still isn't the champ, that in itself made the result a great one. But with HHH saying before the match that this was it, and him and Batista were done, methinks Batista could be the one to go to SD!, and nip the SD Title in the bud. We'll find out this week.
Kane Is Ugly
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#6 Posted on 26.6.05 2335.20
Reposted on: 26.6.12 2337.30
    Originally posted by Juggalo101
    30 minutes after Vengeance and no thread?
    Hmmmm....

    -Entertaining show, but nothing memorable. As far as Hell in the Cell's go, third from the bottom up in front of Trips/Nash and Bossman/Taker.


So, Al Snow vs Big Boss Man was BETTER than this match? Wow...
Juggalo101
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#7 Posted on 26.6.05 2339.16
Reposted on: 26.6.12 2339.28
    Originally posted by Kane Is Ugly
      Originally posted by Juggalo101
      30 minutes after Vengeance and no thread?
      Hmmmm....

      -Entertaining show, but nothing memorable. As far as Hell in the Cell's go, third from the bottom up in front of Trips/Nash and Bossman/Taker.


    So, Al Snow vs Big Boss Man was BETTER than this match? Wow...


Heh...Who really counts that as "Hell in a Cell?"
Freeway
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#8 Posted on 26.6.05 2341.47
Reposted on: 26.6.12 2341.55
    Originally posted by Juggalo101
      Originally posted by Kane Is Ugly
        Originally posted by Juggalo101
        30 minutes after Vengeance and no thread?
        Hmmmm....

        -Entertaining show, but nothing memorable. As far as Hell in the Cell's go, third from the bottom up in front of Trips/Nash and Bossman/Taker.


      So, Al Snow vs Big Boss Man was BETTER than this match? Wow...


    Heh...Who really counts that as "Hell in a Cell?"


The WWE. It's one of the previous 12 they mentioned.
TheMASKEDComputerGeek
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#9 Posted on 26.6.05 2356.14
Reposted on: 26.6.12 2356.17
    Originally posted by Packman V2
    crowd was extremely loud, probably a result of the Hardy entrance played on Raw.


What???
Juggalo101
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#10 Posted on 26.6.05 2358.31
Reposted on: 26.6.12 2358.45
    Originally posted by Freeway420
      Originally posted by Juggalo101
        Originally posted by Kane Is Ugly
          Originally posted by Juggalo101
          30 minutes after Vengeance and no thread?
          Hmmmm....

          -Entertaining show, but nothing memorable. As far as Hell in the Cell's go, third from the bottom up in front of Trips/Nash and Bossman/Taker.


        So, Al Snow vs Big Boss Man was BETTER than this match? Wow...


      Heh...Who really counts that as "Hell in a Cell?"


    The WWE. It's one of the previous 12 they mentioned.

Well, you forced me check out the history books to see if they actually did count it...

1) Shawn Michaels -vs- The Undertaker (Badd Blood 1997)

2) Steve Austin & The Undertaker -vs- Kane & Mankind (RAW)

3) Mankind -vs- The Undertaker (King Of The Ring 1998)

4) Kane -vs- Mankind (RAW)

5) The Undertaker -vs- Big Bossman (Wrestlemania XV)

6) Cactus Jack -vs- Triple H (No Way Out 2000)

7) HHH -vs- The Rock -vs- The Undertaker -vs- Steve Austin -vs- Rikishi -vs- Kurt Angle (Armageddon 2000)

8) Chris Jericho -vs- Triple H (Judgment Day 2002)

9) Undertaker -vs- Brock Lesnar (No Mercy 2002)

10) Kevin Nash -vs- Triple H (Bad Blood 2003)

11) Shawn Michaels -vs- Triple H (Bad Blood 2004)

Well, what'dya know? They actually did...For a company that isn't very accurate when it comes to releasing information about their history, I didn't expect them to even include the Raw matches.

Now...excluding the infamous "Kennel From Hell" and the Raw HIAC matches, I stand by my statement. :-)
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#11 Posted on 27.6.05 0323.27
Reposted on: 27.6.12 0324.35
The bar I saw it at was packed and people loved three things. Cena winning, Victoria kicking the crap out of Christy, and Batista winning.

Carlito vs Shelton was okay, but nothing spectacular.

Victoria beating Christy was suprisingly not horrid. Christy looks a little better in the ring each time out. But, would she PLEASE stop running in place ALL THE TIME? She's getting beat down in the corner and her feet are still pumping up and down. It's rediculous and distracting.

Kane over Edge was entertaining. Noting spectacular, but I wasnt expecting anything much other than punches and chokeslams anyhows. Nice of Lita to acknowledge the "she's a crackwhore" chants.

Angle vs HBK. Match of the night, as far as I am concerned. Sets them up for ONE MORE match at Survivor Series, to settle the score and see who is the better man. Kurt can still go. Even if it is at 90%. 90% of him is better than 100% of MOST of the roster.

Big Vis' Big Diss. Poor Lilian. She gets a decent chance to show some acting skills and THIS is what we get? Although the return of the Ho Train is always welcome.

I hate the way WWE does the triple threat matches. Give me the ELIMINATION match with three people in it, gives them all more motivation to be involved.
Cena going over got the pop of the night where I was at.

HITC was suprisingly good. I loved the barbed wire covered chair. Not a whole lot of ways to "innovate" a HITC match, considering Mick Foley is retired. Although a spinebuster on the steps was pretty brutal. You figure with Ric Flair having worked with Batista for a few years, the guy would know how to blade. Good match, satisfying ending. Now,instead of sending Dave to SMACKDOWN, send HHH.



tsmstu
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#12 Posted on 27.6.05 0735.16
Reposted on: 27.6.12 0736.50
im gonna have to check in and say it was a very solid ppv. Coming off a HOT ecw ppv. the wwe had to hit hard with "their product". (I did hear an ECW chant during the 3 way).

-the triple threat was a great match. Spots were alot of fun and i liked the finish. Even though they ripped off TNA with the whole superplex/powerbomb, it was only "die hards" who would know that anyways.

-HIAC wasn't bad. I liked the finish.

-Why was coach commentating?

-Angle/HBK was awesome, a summerslam rematch is in order. Felt like it was good enough to be a title match.

-Lillian is the worst. She cant sing, and shouldnt. I hate it when the wwe pushes her singing. It will never get over. ever.

-vicotrias GO GO GO GO GO song got slowed down for evil reasons im assuming.

two thumbs up.
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#13 Posted on 27.6.05 0912.21
Reposted on: 27.6.12 0913.25

It was a nice surprise to see the Godfather back, if only for one night. Nice way to bring a little closure to the Lillian/Big Vis angle.

I thoroughly enjoyed the last three matches, especially the Triple Threat. I think I enjoyed it so much because you didn't really know if Cena was walking outta there with the win.

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#14 Posted on 27.6.05 1509.11
Reposted on: 27.6.12 1512.27
    Originally posted by TheMASKEDComputerGeek
      Originally posted by Packman V2
      crowd was extremely loud, probably a result of the Hardy entrance played on Raw.


    What???


During the Edge/Lita weeding the played att hardy's intro music making people think Matt was back but it was jsut Edge and Lita B.S. everyone. So of course everyone started rumors tha tMatt would do a run in during the Edge/Kane match.
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#15 Posted on 27.6.05 1650.59
Reposted on: 27.6.12 1651.56
Might I just add that I was pleasantly surprised that the Cell Match wasn't one of the previous "Tributes to Better Matches". There were very little repeated spots. The chain & barbed wire chair were both new. The finish featured a call-back to WrestleMania X7's Undertaker/HHH match (which had HHH nail Taker with the sledge during the Last Ride for a near-fall), but everything else was fresh.
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#16 Posted on 27.6.05 1814.54
Reposted on: 27.6.12 1817.09
    Originally posted by Juggalo101
      Originally posted by Kane Is Ugly
        Originally posted by Juggalo101
        30 minutes after Vengeance and no thread?
        Hmmmm....

        -Entertaining show, but nothing memorable. As far as Hell in the Cell's go, third from the bottom up in front of Trips/Nash and Bossman/Taker.


      So, Al Snow vs Big Boss Man was BETTER than this match? Wow...


    Heh...Who really counts that as "Hell in a Cell?"


I'm sure Pepper's ghost does, it was in his honor, after all.
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#17 Posted on 27.6.05 1831.23
Reposted on: 27.6.12 1831.59
    Originally posted by tsmstu
    Lillian is the worst. She cant sing, and shouldnt. I hate it when the wwe pushes her singing. It will never get over. ever.


This comment kinda reminded me of a supposed incident that I read awhile back on PWTorch.com that involved Lillian and Triple-H. At the time, Lillian was involved in some sort of storyline, and she showed up at one of the booking meetings to suggest some possible ideas she had for the storyline. When she was done sharing some of her ideas, Triple-H said to her in front of everyone there: "Hey Lillian...why don't you just fucking stick to singing the National Anthem."
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#18 Posted on 27.6.05 1923.42
Reposted on: 27.6.12 1924.33
Lillian is a good singer and a good actress who can weep on cue so you can go right to hell because she's been through enough in the last 24 hours.


This show was freaking great.
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#19 Posted on 27.6.05 1944.31
Reposted on: 27.6.12 1945.48
    Originally posted by JustinShapiro
    Lillian is a good singer and a good actress who can weep on cue so you can go right to hell because she's been through enough in the last 24 hours.


    This show was freaking great.


I don't know about the acting, but she really is a good singer. One of the two times I was at the WWF:New York restaurant was when they were showing Smackdown. They had Lillian come out and sing a couple of songs. She was amazingly decent then, and her rendition of the National Anthem (when it isn't used to get La Resistance some heat) is tremendous.

Uh, the show sounded great?!
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#20 Posted on 27.6.05 2306.03
Reposted on: 27.6.12 2306.05
I have personally always liked Lillian. As for her singing it ia great! I really hate it that Vis dumped her but if anyone knows her just tell her I'll volunteer to be the rebound guy! LMAO!!!!

I am glad to see this scropt end with her and Vis cause it really was going nowhere but it did at least let me get to see her on TV for more than just anouncing the matches.

Heck I am still looking for a Diva magazine to buy, since she is in this one it is finally decent enough to look at
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