The W
Views: 100970244
Main | FAQ | Search: Y! / G | Color chart | Log in for more!
29.11.07 0253
The 7 - Pro Wrestling - Pure Dynamite
This thread has 4 referrals leading to it
Register and log in to post!
Pages: 1 2 Next(9716 newer) Next thread | Previous thread
User
Post (26 total)
EastCoastAvenger
Bockwurst
Level: 49

Posts: 253/536
EXP: 851761
For next: 32128

Since: 4.1.02
From: Clearwater, FL

Since last post: 2029 days
Last activity: 20 hours
#1 Posted on 14.4.02 2006.26
Reposted on: 14.4.09 2010.44
Just got through reading "Pure Dynamite" by Tom Billington, aka Dynamite Kid. I must say, It was shorter, and had more spelling errors, but this book has actually replaced Mick Foley's "Have a Nice Day" as my favorite wrestling-related book of all time! The man was hardcore both in and out of the ring, and had a mean streak that would scare a Death Row inmate. Personal favorite part: The fact that Ed Leslie is indeed the LUCKIEST man walking the earth. It's almost too bad... If Dynamite's back had held out just a bit longer, We would not have been subjected to the horrible, human rights violation known as Ed Leslie's WCW run! On one hand I appreciate his balls for facing the consequences of his lifestyle with no regrets, on the other I wonder how far he would have gotten without the roids and coke fueling his insane style of wrestling.

The book came as 1/2 of a package that included a tape compilation of Dynamite's best singles matches. The matches he put on with the Original Tiger Mask (Sayama) were better than anything I've seen from the WWF in years.

Has anyone else seen any of Dynamite Kid's singles matches from the late 70s/eighties, and therefore understand why he's now easily in the top 3 of my list of greatest wrestlers of all time?
Promote this thread!
HarleM HeAt
Pickled pork
Level: 32

Posts: 25/197
EXP: 188214
For next: 18230

Since: 23.3.02
From: Nova Scotia,Canada

Since last post: 3801 days
Last activity: 3607 days
ICQ:  
#2 Posted on 15.4.02 0844.46
Reposted on: 15.4.09 0845.00
I got this book for christmas this year and read it one sitting. I couldnt put it down. It is a great read especially when you've read "have a nice day", beacuase it gives you a look at the differences in the wwf ten years before Mick Foleys intake. My Favorite story in the bio is the fight dynamite has with the Rougeou Brothers and ends up getting jumped by the men backstage in fornt of Pat Patterson. Also the stories Dynamite gives willingly about slipping Yellow Jackets, among other drugs into fellow wrestlers drinks. Priceless to read about and shocking and dangerous. I great read for any wrestling fan of the 80's.
Travis
Boerewors
Level: 42

Posts: 272/385
EXP: 515101
For next: 6265

Since: 7.3.02
From: Baltimore, MD

Since last post: 4575 days
Last activity: 4511 days
AIM:  
ICQ:  
#3 Posted on 15.4.02 0913.14
Reposted on: 15.4.09 0919.53
I've seen alot of Dynamite from the 80's. He was truly something special. His work with guys like Takano and Sayama should be required viewing for all those Tough Enough scrubs. Instead they're too busy focusing on cutting promos with the Brawler.

Oh, wrestling...
Qubber
Boerewors
Level: 42

Posts: 264/375
EXP: 498316
For next: 23050

Since: 7.1.02
From: Sheffield, UK

Since last post: 2787 days
Last activity: 2050 days
AIM:  
#4 Posted on 15.4.02 0934.42
Reposted on: 15.4.09 0934.55
It's funny, to anyone who has ever seen any of his matches, Dynamite Kid is easily considered on of the greatest of all time, yet you never see him in the all time top ten lists. Maybe it's because a lot of people into wrestling now came in during the Attitude era and have no memory of him (it's easier to find out about Flair and Hogan than the mid-carders, I guess, and that's assuming anyone is interested in wrestling's history anyway). Maybe it's because the other British Bulldog has had more recent success/tabloid disgrace (as an aside for those who have read the book: Tom is slightly bitter about old Davey Boy, eh?). Maybe it's to do with his unpopularity with the boys for all those stiff matches. Whatever it is, purely as a fan, I'd put him in my all time top 5 list without a second thought.
MoeGates
Andouille
Level: 88

Posts: 422/2109
EXP: 6646503
For next: 4187

Since: 6.1.02
From: Brooklyn, NY

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 6 hours
#5 Posted on 15.4.02 1429.30
Reposted on: 15.4.09 1431.36
Even the folks (like myself) who came of age during, or slightly before, the Rock & Wrestling era don't have memories of the "top-level" Dynamite. We remember the Dynamite Kid as half of the British Bulldogs & putting on good & entertaining, but not "best wrestler of all time" quality matches.

Unless you've somehow seen his stuff in early eighties in Japan and Stampede, you haven't seen what makes Dynamite "top 10" material. This means you're either a) a big puro fan, b) a hardcore tape trader, or c) a Canadian/Rocky Mountain or Japan native over the age of 30. Even in the Internet crowd, these three groups are a minority.

Moe
EastCoastAvenger
Bockwurst
Level: 49

Posts: 255/536
EXP: 851761
For next: 32128

Since: 4.1.02
From: Clearwater, FL

Since last post: 2029 days
Last activity: 20 hours
#6 Posted on 15.4.02 1532.55
Reposted on: 15.4.09 1540.22
I'm dafinitely "A" and "B". Well, actually, I don't trade, I've got a pretty good hookup and can get tht tapes for about 10-15 bucks each. But without the tapes, the only memories I'd have of his career would be the post surgery, about to fall apart from years of hard living Dynamite Kid.

I'm not sure if it's bitterness, I mean he does have a right to be pissed off. The guy was family, yet still thought it was cool to screw him over time and time again.

Good point about the stiff matches. Most guys in the "top ten" lists tend to be pussies about taking the hard bumps. Hulk Hogan probably would have shit his pants during a match with Dynamite Kid, then had the kid blacklisted permanently in America. Heck, how many guys today are willing to wrestle stiff like Dynamite? Benoit, Angle... Damn, I need help on this one! Besides those two, who is both willing and able to wrestle a truly stiff technical match?
odessasteps
Scrapple
Level: 129

Posts: 415/5065
EXP: 24747860
For next: 301861

Since: 2.1.02
From: MD, USA

Since last post: 164 days
Last activity: 131 days
#7 Posted on 15.4.02 1543.04
Reposted on: 15.4.09 1559.05

    Originally posted by EastCoastAvenger
    Besides those two, who is both willing and able to wrestle a truly stiff technical match?


Are we just talking about North Americans?

Dr. Death?
Mike Barton?

I would assume most of the stiff people are not the technical types, like Bradshaw and the like.

I'm assuming you could include Lesnar and Benjamin in the mix, given their amateur credentials.

Travis
Boerewors
Level: 42

Posts: 281/385
EXP: 515101
For next: 6265

Since: 7.3.02
From: Baltimore, MD

Since last post: 4575 days
Last activity: 4511 days
AIM:  
ICQ:  
#8 Posted on 15.4.02 1546.13
Reposted on: 15.4.09 1559.08

    Originally posted by odessasteps

      Originally posted by EastCoastAvenger
      Besides those two, who is both willing and able to wrestle a truly stiff technical match?


    Are we just talking about North Americans?

    Dr. Death?
    Mike Barton?

    I would assume most of the stiff people are not the technical types, like Bradshaw and the like.

    I'm assuming you could include Lesnar and Benjamin in the mix, given their amateur credentials.



Jericho's willing to throw stiff chops and whatnot. Regal's all kinds of into pummeling people (like Lance Storm). Bradshaw's sloppiness shouldn't be confused for stiffness.
Jamie Knoble comes to mind...
EastCoastAvenger
Bockwurst
Level: 49

Posts: 256/536
EXP: 851761
For next: 32128

Since: 4.1.02
From: Clearwater, FL

Since last post: 2029 days
Last activity: 20 hours
#9 Posted on 15.4.02 1607.59
Reposted on: 15.4.09 1611.31
I should have clarified: I meant wrestlers in North America who are willing to wrestle "strong style", where both guys leave the match a bit bruised up, but neither one was ever in danger of being paralyzed by a sloppily done move. Regal's a good example of that. If they gave him more than 30 seconds on tv, I'm sure Lance Storm would wrestle that style. Dr. Death scares me, and not in a good way. I watch his backdrops, suplexes and powerbombs and I cringe, wondering if their luck ran out and Doc has just ended a man's career. Bradshaw is a maybe, and Faarooq has his moments. I can think of quite a few times I've watched Faarooq's matches and wondered if his opponent had ribbed him backstage and he was getting some payback in the ring. I'll never forget the time he did a Dominator on Jeff hardy and damn near KILLED him. I'll take your word on Lesnar and Benjamin. I've seen Brock in the amateurs, and he was a legit badass. Looks like the only things that changed is the fact that he has more tattoos and wears less clothing.
odessasteps
Scrapple
Level: 129

Posts: 416/5065
EXP: 24747860
For next: 301861

Since: 2.1.02
From: MD, USA

Since last post: 164 days
Last activity: 131 days
#10 Posted on 15.4.02 1847.19
Reposted on: 15.4.09 1847.46

Regal is the person I forgot.

I was there for the Regal/Benoit match at the Pillman show and it was stiffer than stiff. Both got busted hardway from chops and headbutts.

Tragic1
Chourico
Level: 36

Posts: 123/265
EXP: 296162
For next: 11951

Since: 2.1.02
From: Rolling Meadows, Illinois

Since last post: 4407 days
Last activity: 4398 days
#11 Posted on 15.4.02 2107.34
Reposted on: 15.4.09 2107.34
ECA: Please explain to me why it's not okay for Tazz and Bob Holly to yell at and stretch Tough Enough trainees but it is okay for the Dynamite Kid to drug guys and attempt to end careers by shooting on them in matches. There seems to be some discrepancies between your thread here and your commenst on the hard asses of the Tough Enough series.
EastCoastAvenger
Bockwurst
Level: 49

Posts: 258/536
EXP: 851761
For next: 32128

Since: 4.1.02
From: Clearwater, FL

Since last post: 2029 days
Last activity: 20 hours
#12 Posted on 15.4.02 2115.35
Reposted on: 15.4.09 2116.04
Dynamite did it to guys of relatively equal status. He never once implied that retaliation would result in loss of their job. In fact, he expected retaliation, and got it quite a few times.

Tazz and Hardcore did it to a bunch of kids who A: haven't been trained for this line of work yet, and B: Would be cut for raising their voice at the trainer, let alone pull something like the Rougeau brothers did to Dynamite (lie in wait, then sucker punch him with brass knucks.)

Dynamite reserved his sadistic behavior for equals, while Tazz and Holly reserved it for people who couldn't fight back. At least that's how I see it.
Tragic1
Chourico
Level: 36

Posts: 124/265
EXP: 296162
For next: 11951

Since: 2.1.02
From: Rolling Meadows, Illinois

Since last post: 4407 days
Last activity: 4398 days
#13 Posted on 15.4.02 2128.25
Reposted on: 15.4.09 2129.04
Tazz and Bob Holly may be in a position of power in regards to the TE kids, but it seems that some of Dynamite's actions were a bit extreme. Tazz and Holly are probably limited in what they can really do due to being filmed all the time and the threats of a lawsuit if any of the trainees feel that they were taken advantage of. Even if they did sign a waiver before entering, those can be overruled in a court of law. But spiking drinks and attempting to physically harm another human being as a joke, even against those of equal status, goes a bit too far. The risk of another man dying from a cocktail of booze and drugs seems to me a bit worse than Tazz and Holly.

BTW, do not consider this an indictment against Dynamite Kid the worker. I was one of many 10 year olds at the Rosemont Horizon holding the lid of a Reebok shoebox during the six man cage match between Honky Tonk Man/Hart Foundation and Bulldogs/Savage
MoeGates
Andouille
Level: 88

Posts: 423/2109
EXP: 6646503
For next: 4187

Since: 6.1.02
From: Brooklyn, NY

Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 6 hours
#14 Posted on 15.4.02 2143.39
Reposted on: 15.4.09 2145.43
I find it pretty funny that in Martha Hart's book Dynamite is portrayed as about the biggest piece of shit ever to walk the earth...and all the stories of him in there are pretty much the same as in Dynamite's own book.

Moe
EastCoastAvenger
Bockwurst
Level: 49

Posts: 259/536
EXP: 851761
For next: 32128

Since: 4.1.02
From: Clearwater, FL

Since last post: 2029 days
Last activity: 20 hours
#15 Posted on 15.4.02 2208.38
Reposted on: 15.4.09 2209.43
Think about it. Was it really too far? The guys whose drinks he spiked were known substance abusers with systems so used to large amounts of drugs that the effects predictably caused temporary discomfort. As for the incidents where he was about to cause serious physical harm with his bare hands, I can see where he was coming from. The first time, he got jumped and sent to the hospital. The other, the Beefcake incident, was as a result of Brutus disrespecting Billington's mentor. Dude, both cases would cause me to get violent, so I can't BEGIN to fault him for wanting to break some bones.

So, at least the way I see it, a guy giving drugs to fellow drug users (albeit unsolicited and unbenownst to the guys receiving them), and a guy wanting to lay some hurt on the guys who disrespected him. Rough? oh yeah, I won't even try to deny that. But it was a rough group of guys. They regularly spiked each other's drinks (remember when DK's heart stopped 3 times?), and kicked the shit out of each other for what would look like no reason to the average Joe. Most times, they shrugged it off and the bond was strengthened between them, except in the rare cases of the Rougeaus and Davey Boy (who still seem to be scared shitless of DK even though he is broke and confined to a wheelchair).

Like I said, it's all a personal POV, but I think that abusing underlings who have no real way to fight back makes you nothing more than a punk bitch. Among friends and equals, I think it's different. Sure, I wouldn't slip yellowjackets into a friend's beer (none of my friends have touched anything stronger than 151), but I have been known to pass out a few ex-lax flavored brownies before a rugby game.

Qubber
Boerewors
Level: 42

Posts: 265/375
EXP: 498316
For next: 23050

Since: 7.1.02
From: Sheffield, UK

Since last post: 2787 days
Last activity: 2050 days
AIM:  
#16 Posted on 16.4.02 0348.29
Reposted on: 16.4.09 0350.56
While (obviously) I'm a major Dynamite Kid fan, I tend to think he busted up people way below him on the foodchain, and that wasn't right at all. It's one thing to work strong style against a company mainstay, but let's not forget one of Mick Foley's first matches, when he was a mere jobber, involved Dynamite kicking the shit out of him for real. I suppose you could argue that as a pro wrestler you have to be prepared for that, but I wouldn't agree. Foley's comment about how you treat people on the way up affecting how you get treated on the way down seems particularly apt.

There's no excuse for abusing your position like that. What I'm saying is Regal doing it to Goldberg is one thing but Saturn/Steiner/Dynamite doing it to a jobber is a whole other kettle of fish.
EastCoastAvenger
Bockwurst
Level: 49

Posts: 260/536
EXP: 851761
For next: 32128

Since: 4.1.02
From: Clearwater, FL

Since last post: 2029 days
Last activity: 20 hours
#17 Posted on 16.4.02 0956.03
Reposted on: 16.4.09 0957.18
Come on now. That was Dynamite Kid's style. He worked stiff with EVERYONE. This was a reason that a lot of people actually shied away from working matches with him. The fact that he was in a wheelchair before 40 due to the constant wear and tear should show that the stiffness went both ways during his matches.

Also, the match was a tag match against the Bulldogs was'nt it? If we're thinking of the same match, then it was more Davey Boy kicking the shit out of Foley during the match because he thought Mick was trying to "take liberties" during the match. Apparently he was under the impression that Mick was a lot more experienced than he actually was.

As for regularly beating on guys below him, he wrestled strong style, and can't think of any match where he went easy on someone whether thay were J-brones or main-eventers. Even after his back surgery, he kept going full speed. Better to burn out than fade away, and all that jazz...

albert44
Italian
Level: 35

Posts: 53/240
EXP: 254149
For next: 25789

Since: 12.2.02
From: houston , TX

Since last post: 3434 days
Last activity: 3166 days
#18 Posted on 16.4.02 1018.01
Reposted on: 16.4.09 1018.33
He east coast avenger. My favorite match on that tape is the
match Dynamite and Sayama had in Madison Square Garden.
They get no crowd reaction what so ever in the intros , but by the
end the people are going ape sh!t!!!!!!
EastCoastAvenger
Bockwurst
Level: 49

Posts: 263/536
EXP: 851761
For next: 32128

Since: 4.1.02
From: Clearwater, FL

Since last post: 2029 days
Last activity: 20 hours
#19 Posted on 16.4.02 1055.38
Reposted on: 16.4.09 1059.03
Beautiful stuff. They absolutely kicked the shit out of each other. Then again, matches like that were also the reason for Dynamite's current status. If they were allowed any tv time, I'm sure the cruiserweights could get that kind of reaction today. That is, if they were allowed to work as stiff and innovatively as Dynamite and Tiger Mask did in their matches. Imagine the fun Dynamite would have had in the UWFi, had he not realized at first glance that the fed had no real chance of surviving 5 years.

I still think Sayama is the best overall Tiger Mask. Misawa is a great wrestler, but his style wasn't really right for the Tiger Mask legacy. Kanemoto (I think I spelled it right...) was also good, but his personality is too bland. The new Tiger Mask is just as good as Sayama, maybe even better, but he's not ushering in a new style like Sayama did.
CxMorgado
Boudin rouge
Level: 47

Posts: 42/498
EXP: 761446
For next: 4763

Since: 21.1.02
From: Boston MA is the rippen'ist town...

Since last post: 340 days
Last activity: 5 hours
#20 Posted on 16.4.02 1105.04
Reposted on: 16.4.09 1107.39
So wait...

Its ok for Davey Boy or Dynamite to stiff Foley in the ring when hes inexperienced because they THOUGHT he was thinking about "taking liberties", but its not ok for Tazz and Bob Holly to yell at or stretch out someone they're supposed to be preparing for the ring (which in my view includes preparing them for people who are gonna beat the shit out of them) because they don't have the experience to deal with it? That makes no sense at all...

I know its your opinion, but saying that Dynamite stiffing an inexperienced wrestler is justified because he "worked stiff with EVERYONE" and saying that it's not ok for a guy like Bob Holly who works stiff (and in my view hes a lot less stiff than Dynamite) to occaisionally give one of his students a stiff shot or to even yell at them when they screw up just comes off as hero worship to me...
Pages: 1 2 NextThread ahead: Wrestling School
Next thread: Jazz vs. Trish this sunday? WTF?!
Previous thread: Sell me on RVD
(9716 newer) Next thread | Previous thread
The 7 - Pro Wrestling - Pure DynamiteRegister and log in to post!

The W™ message board - 7 year recycle

ZimBoard
©2001-2014 Brothers Zim
This old hunk of junk rendered your page in 0.34 seconds.