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24.7.07 0724
The 7 - Baseball - Yankees / Red Sox Fan interference and assault
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Guru Zim
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#1 Posted on 14.4.05 2100.39
Reposted on: 14.4.12 2104.39
Since when did it become OK to assault a fan?

I realize the fan had his arm in the field of play, but how do the announcers justify Sheffield hitting the fan?

"You can understand why Sheffield is upset" - Yeah so he gets to go shove a guy because the fan (who is watching the ball) brushes him?

I don't get it. I'm not sure why the players are allowed to hit fans.
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Whitebacon
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#2 Posted on 14.4.05 2101.44
Reposted on: 14.4.12 2104.40
You don't know what you're talking about. You never played the game. /dibble
odessasteps
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#3 Posted on 14.4.05 2108.52
Reposted on: 14.4.12 2110.59

I understand Sheff being upset that the fan got in his way and maybe hit him. But not enough to shove the guy.

And F*** Sutcliffe for completely defending the player in the situation. He also wouldn't accept the beer may have been spilt by accident.

When the 800=lb gorilla is the voice of reason, it's not a good situation.
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#4 Posted on 14.4.05 2139.20
Reposted on: 14.4.12 2140.58
Watching the NESN broadcast, I first thought it was just another incident of roid rage for Sheffield. However, after watching the replay, as much as I hate to say it, I don't blame him because the jackass in the stands threw a weak uppercut at him. To paraphrase the late, great Sherm Feller: He should be subject to arrest and prostitution. If the guy claims he was reaching for the ball, he should be arrested anyway for stupidity, as it would have cost the Red Sox a run.
Onto the game: 3-3 over the first 6, and thankfully the two teams don't see each other again until Memorial Day weekend. At some point, the Yankees are going to have to stop wheeling Tom Gordon out to face Boston, as they have hit him hard. Johnson hit hard in last two starts, showing there is a slight difference between A.L. East line-ups and N.L. West line-ups. I'm about 7-10 games away from thinking Ramirez is suffering Jim Rice disease. And, I will keep insisting Matsui scares me the most out of the guys in the Yankee order.

(edited by redsoxnation on 14.4.05 2240)
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#5 Posted on 14.4.05 2210.20
Reposted on: 14.4.12 2210.32
No way he threw an uppercut. Just like Bartman, the guy was watching the ball the whole way, and when he missed his shot at it he pulled his arm up.

Yes, he was stupid and shouldn't have put his arm in the field of play, but what was he supposed to do once it was there - leave it there for Sheff to run into?
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#6 Posted on 14.4.05 2247.48
Reposted on: 14.4.12 2248.20
Anyone who actually watches the replay, and not just listen to ESPN's take on it, will clearly see that the fan isn't even looking at Sheffield. He also clearly didn't "attack" him or "take a swing" at him. What I clearly see is a drunk person going after the ball and proving that alcohol slows your reflexes and your mind. His hand accidently barely touches Sheffield. But since players seem to be so ultra-sensitive to these things, Sheffield blew it up into some big incident.

Can anyone honestly say that had Sheffield just played on and ignored the incident that anyone would have made anything of it? Does it even get mention?

(edited by ges7184 on 14.4.05 2249)

(edited by ges7184 on 14.4.05 2251)
Whitebacon
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#7 Posted on 14.4.05 2249.07
Reposted on: 14.4.12 2253.19
My 75 year old grandmother could throw a better punch at Sheff if that's what this guy was trying to do, and that's AFTER a case of Mickey's.



    Can anyone honestly say that had Sheffield just played on and ignored the incident that anyone would have made anything of it? Does even get it mention?



You're absolutely right. If he throws the ball in instead of going after the fan before he threw it, and leaves well enough alone after throwing the ball, this would barely register on the radar at all.

(edited by Whitebacon on 14.4.05 2050)
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#8 Posted on 15.4.05 0007.59
Reposted on: 15.4.12 0007.59
I completely missed it while working. The game was on, and I watched (my co-workers growing ever more weary of my ranting after the eigth), but all I noticed was a scuffle in the crowds and the guy being escorted out.

Honestly, if I was a Yankee player in Fenway diving into the stands for a catch, I'd have packed a knife.
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#9 Posted on 15.4.05 0541.50
Reposted on: 15.4.12 0544.39
Sheffield already gets a "f*ck you" from me due to his being an asshat in Milwaukee back during his Brewers days...but a Yankee going after a member of Red Sox Nation earns it a 2x magnifier. Whatta tool.

I've reviewed this video over and over at work today, and here's my conclusions:

* ESPN announcers (even you, Boomer): STFU. Seriously.

* Hard to tell from his weird-ass arm actions, but it looks to me like the fan in question, Chris House, is attempting to do the Wonder Twins fist-touch w/ the fan 2 seats to his left: dude in blue jacket who has both arms outstretched along the dugout wall, cheering. House ended up chucking the guy 1 seat to his left (red jacket) in the nose. Either way, it was NOT, repeat, NOT, a swing at Shef.

* House also had his left arm around red-jacket-guy 1 seat over for balance (more on fan balance later.)

* As Sheffield picks up the ball, all fans from House over to the left start leaning to the right...obviously somebody's pushing, and several people are losing their balance.

* As Sheffield swings like an idiot at House, the guy 3 seats over from him does NOT throw his beer at Sheffield. In fact, he takes a drink from it during the alleged "swipe." Something hits his left (beer-carrying) arm...probably the arm of the girl to his left (2 seats away from House) moving to recoil from the aforementioned asshat...er, Sheffield.

* Fan balance is proven not-so-good as the lady over House's right shoulder completely falls down during her recoil from Sheffield, taking the fans 2 and 3 seats over (the beer couple) from House out. Those ladies looked SCARED.

(EDIT: They saw no evil, according to the Milford Daily News.)

    Originally posted by Milford Daily-News article linked above
    Helen Lambropolous of Haverhill, one of two women who could be seen on TV replays guarding their beer just off to the side of where House was standing, said she believed the whole incident was a ``misunderstanding.'' The other woman, Linda Annese of Saugus, said, ``My gut feeling from watching (House) was that it wasn't malicious at all.''


* Props to House for asking Sheffield "What?" when Shef confronted him for the 2nd time (after throwing Varitek's 3B-worthy ball back in) and not responding to Sheffield's weak-as-A-Rod glove smack. Too bad he got kicked out; but I'm glad House's not getting arrested or charged with the crime of uh, getting hit by Sheffield.

* More props to Fenway security to getting there right away and keeping the fans as safe as possible.

Basically, there's no way you can defend Sheffield in this one. And that's my unbiased review...despite my personal pro-Sox, anti-Yankee, F-you-Sheffield views, I call 'em as I see 'em. At least while on the clock...which I am. :-)

(EDIT: Chris House, from Dorchester, is the fan-in-question, sez the Milford Daily News.)

(edited by The Thrill on 15.4.05 0722)
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#10 Posted on 15.4.05 0607.32
Reposted on: 15.4.12 0608.49
The Yankee announcers on YES Michael Kay and Jim Kaat didn't really go out of their way to defend Sheffield, but they may have changed their tune during the post-game show.

"Ron Artest was the first thing that came to my mind. Don't react,"

"It could've been worse, but I held my composure. I thought about the consequences," Sheffield said.


I think Sheffield overreated making something out of nothing, and drawing us one step closer to watching games behind a steel cage.



(edited by BigDaddyLoco on 15.4.05 0717)
odessasteps
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#11 Posted on 15.4.05 0612.21
Reposted on: 15.4.12 0614.34

One of my friends emailed last night to say:

"What that "clear rage" or "Cream Rage?" "
Grimis
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#12 Posted on 15.4.05 0648.36
Reposted on: 15.4.12 0648.38
Sheffield won't be suspended...but he should be.
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#13 Posted on 15.4.05 0649.44
Reposted on: 15.4.12 0650.23
Yeah, he weakly pushed a guy. Seems like an out of control roid rage to me.

Nobody got hurt, nobody got HIT, nobody got anything more rough that what would happen in a crowded subway car.

I just dont see where the fury at Sheffield is coming from.
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#14 Posted on 15.4.05 0723.13
Reposted on: 15.4.12 0725.42
Look at it from Sheffield's POV.

He's not looking at the fans, he's looking at the ball.

He's a Yankee in Boston and his worst fear came true. He's at the wall and felt a bump. He instinctively does the "NBA player swinging his elbows after a rebound" sorta deal, and plays the ball.

In self-defense, you're allowed that free hit. He may have saw the dude's arm after it came downwards, but the point is that he felt a bump, and felt he was being assaulted.

That "assault" looked pretty weak, and accidental. That "self-defense act" looked pretty weak, and hurried as he had a live ball.

After the throw, he went back, and that's where the real trouble could have started.

People should stop harping on the fact that he shoved a fan he felt assaulted him, but instead focus on the fact that he went back for a 2nd hit and held himself back.

This could have been Artest all over again and he knew that. That first hit was free, MAYBE a small $1K fine, MAYBE. I'll be VERY shocked if he misses ANY games for this. If he did do hit #2, he'd be done for at least a fortnight.

Security was on the ball, the guy was obviously drunk and couldn't field that ball if it fell in his lap, and after it was all said and done, I think it was much ado about nothing.
ges7184
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#15 Posted on 15.4.05 0756.31
Reposted on: 15.4.12 0758.20
You don't get a "free hit" for self-defense. You can only start using self-defense if you have no other option. Considering Sheffield has a whole baseball field to retreat to, he had plenty of options to avoid a confrontation. Some people confuse self-defense with retaliation, but they are not the same thing. We don't live in a eye-for-an-eye world. (and do we really want to live in the world where every instance of incidental contact entitles the contactee to a free punch?)
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#16 Posted on 15.4.05 0827.32
Reposted on: 15.4.12 0829.01
A couple of things about the whole thing that pissed me off:

1) Joe Torre's comments after the game were ridiculous! Something along the lines of "these people shouldn't even be walking the streets, let alone at a baseball game". Kind of ironic coming from the mouth of the manager of the team with some of the most idiotic fans ever.
Not really all that surprising though since Torre has always been a manager that will defend his players no matter what, & often when it contradicts comments he'd made in the past (i.e. calling Clemens a headhunter when he pitched for the Blue Jays & then defending him when he threw at players for the Yanks), but he really sounded like a moron after the game. At least Sheffield focused on his reaction instead of the "attack" by the fan...

2) ESPN's coverage was really annoying & just a bit overblown. It's one thing to focus an entire SportsCenter or Baseball Tonight on the Red Sox-Yankees game when it's a playoff game, but last night was simply absurd.
The first half hour of SportsCenter showed complete highlights of the game TWICE & did not show one other baseball game on the schedule. In the second half hour they showed 3 highlights from the first game in 4+ decades in DC (W throwing out the pitch, Castilla's HR & the last out), 1 highlight of the Mets-Astros game (Reyes' IF single to put the Mets ahead) & that's IT (aside from a few Top 10 plays)!!
Baseball tonight (the 20 minute "Trifecta" version) did more of the same, except they may have showed 1 highlight of another game, but less of the Nationals opener.
To cover that game the way they did & to basically ignore the rest of the games on the schedule is simply ridiculous & insulting to the many SportsCenter viewers who are fans of teams other than the Yanks & Sox. People watch SportsCenter to get the days highlights & the sports stories of the day, not 1 set of highlights & ad-nauseum reporting on that (essentially non-story) for 45 minutes of the hour.
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#17 Posted on 15.4.05 1224.24
Reposted on: 15.4.12 1226.10
    Originally posted by Zeruel
    Look at it from Sheffield's POV.

    He's not looking at the fans, he's looking at the ball.

    He's a Yankee in Boston and his worst fear came true. He's at the wall and felt a bump. He instinctively does the "NBA player swinging his elbows after a rebound" sorta deal, and plays the ball.

Seriously, why don't more people look at it this way? Sure the fan may have had no intentions of coming into contact with Sheffield, but how is HE to know that? All he knew is that someone hit him. He got the guy out of his face and played on AND THEN RESTRAINED HIMSELF FROM RETALIATING ANY FURTHER. I hate the Yankees more than the next guy, and being a Braves fan I don't have any sort of love for Sheffield, but really, why is this so bad?

- StingArmy
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#18 Posted on 15.4.05 1239.52
Reposted on: 15.4.12 1246.16
I have to agree that it's not that big of a deal, it's just ESPN blowing another non-issue out of proportion. The fan didn't PUNCH Sheffield but Sheffield didn't PUNCH him either, it was just a little shove. Should he touch the fan? No. Should the fan have been in the way? No. To me they both made a small mistake, that's it. The roid rage comments are stupid, if it was roid rage he would've gone into the stands and beat the guy with the baseball while the runner scored. But the way that Boston fans, Red Sox and Patriots, have been acting I wouldn't mind seeing that at all.
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#19 Posted on 15.4.05 1327.56
Reposted on: 15.4.12 1327.58
You are not lying, ESPN did overblow the whole situation. This happens all the time in the minor leagues. Anyway I could not believe ESPN put George Bush throwing out the first pitch at the Nationals game as a back page story. Anyway credit goes to the security kid for having the matter under control.
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#20 Posted on 15.4.05 1406.37
Reposted on: 15.4.12 1407.58
    Originally posted by StaggerLee
    Yeah, he weakly pushed a guy. Seems like an out of control roid rage to me.

    Nobody got hurt, nobody got HIT, nobody got anything more rough that what would happen in a crowded subway car.

    I just dont see where the fury at Sheffield is coming from.



Tell that to Milton Bradley, who threw a bottle on the ground and got a 5 game suspension last year.
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