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The 7 - Current Events & Politics - Draft could be re-instated June 15
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It's False
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#1 Posted on 10.2.05 0400.20
Reposted on: 10.2.12 0402.37
http://www.projectcensored.org/publications/2005/24.html

If this is true, then it's time to start sweating...
Promote this thread!
Grimis
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#2 Posted on 10.2.05 0657.26
Reposted on: 10.2.12 0657.37
Or get a life, do some research, and stop believing the conspiracy theories:

    Originally posted by Carol Van houten, 6/25/2004
    To resume a draft, Congress would have to pass authorizing legislation. No bill currently in Congress would do that. Legislation introduced this session by Rep. Charles Rangel, D-N.Y., (House Resolution 163) is actually a protest against the current "poverty draft," in which armed forces members are now disproportionately people of color, and come from rural areas and poor families. This bill deserves national debate because it calls for universal service, by males and females, either in military service or civilian service. However, it is not a bill to reinstitute the draft.

    The Selective Service System is a precursor to the draft because its purpose is to identify all males as they turn 18 years old. The last person drafted was in 1973 in the midst of the Vietnam War, and in 1975 the Selective Service system was ended, only to be revived in 1980.

    Since that time, local draft boards have met annually. Because a term of service for draft board members is 20 years, it is not surprising that in 2004 there are many vacancies.
Let's not neglect that the only guy to keep introducing a draft bill is a DEMOCRAT and that the Defense Department wants nothing to do with draftees...
JayJayDean
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#3 Posted on 10.2.05 0754.57
Reposted on: 10.2.12 0755.02
    Originally posted by Grimis
    Or get a life, do some research, and stop believing the conspiracy theories


That's FUNNY.
CRZ
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#4 Posted on 10.2.05 1021.20
Reposted on: 10.2.12 1021.40
    Originally posted by JayJayDean
      Originally posted by Grimis
      Or get a life, do some research, and stop believing the conspiracy theories


    That's FUNNY.
And neither of these comments was necessary. You both should know better.
ShotGunShep
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#5 Posted on 10.2.05 1031.42
Reposted on: 10.2.12 1032.37
Well considering that the House voted on this last year and it was defeated 402-2. I'm not really worried.
Zeruel
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#6 Posted on 10.2.05 1045.59
Reposted on: 10.2.12 1047.15
Enacting a draft, by either side of the aisle, would be political suicide right now.

(edited by Zeruel on 10.2.05 1146)
spf
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#7 Posted on 10.2.05 1059.07
Reposted on: 10.2.12 1100.36
    Originally posted by Zeruel
    Enacting a draft, by either side of the aisle, would be political suicide right now.

    (edited by Zeruel on 10.2.05 1146)

Would it? In the current political climate if you spun it out there as:

A) Necessary in order to continue to fight the war on terror, replete with many mentions of how both Iran and PDRK have nuclear weapons which are far more accepted facts than anything Iraq had.

B) An opportunity to engage young people, an otherwise godless group of slackers into valuable national service and give them discipline.

C) An economic boost as a lot of otherwise underemployed people would be suddenly well-employed instead of working as a barista at Starbucks.

D) Every generation's patriotic duty. After all, the Greatest Generation served to fight Germany and Japan. The children of Vietnam stood up to the Red Menace bravely for over a decade and helped to stem the tide of Communism, eventually leading indirectly to the fall of the Berlin Wall. Isn't it time for this generation to step up and serve in the defining conflict of this era, the fight between the Freedom-loving civilized people of the West against the Radical America-hating barbarians of Islamofascism?

Are you going to tell me the voters in the Red States would not at least be willing to hear out that argument if presented by Bush and the GOP?
David Adams
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#8 Posted on 10.2.05 1152.39
Reposted on: 10.2.12 1152.44
    Originally posted by spf
    Are you going to tell me the voters in the Red States would not at least be willing to hear out that argument if presented by Bush and the GOP?


Yep, I think that's exactly what he's telling you. And if you think differently, then well you're entitled to your opinion, but you'd be wrong.

No one wants a draft. But it sure seems like some people enjoy keeping the threat of it around.
Grimis
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#9 Posted on 10.2.05 1159.27
Reposted on: 10.2.12 1200.04
    Originally posted by spf
    Are you going to tell me the voters in the Red States would not at least be willing to hear out that argument if presented by Bush and the GOP?
Yes, because the draft flies in the face of freedom and big government.

The only thing that is going to sell a draft again is a legitimate invasion...
redsoxnation
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#10 Posted on 10.2.05 1457.45
Reposted on: 10.2.12 1459.01
Draftees generally equal cannon fodder and diminish morale, so the Pentagon would only want a draft if it was out of desperation.
A few items if by some fluke the draft does get reinstated though:
With the Canada/US agreement, does that mean border protection would go up to prevent draftees from escaping? If so, can I suggest the draftees use the Mexican border, as we don't guard it anyway. And, as always, why flee to Canada after your number comes up. Head to Fiji or Aruba the day the draft is reinstituted. Hell, head to Fiji or Aruba if the draft isn't reinstituted.
If the first guy drafted doesn't file a gender discrimination lawsuit, I'd be shocked. If the draft is going to be reinstituted, put the girls 18-26 in line as well. You want gender equity, you have to take the bad side of it as well.
18-26 for the draft? Well, I've already beat the clock. And spf, you've beaten the clock as well.

(edited by redsoxnation on 10.2.05 1558)
Pool-Boy
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#11 Posted on 10.2.05 1547.40
Reposted on: 10.2.12 1552.08
    Originally posted by redsoxnation
    I suggest the draftees use the Mexican border, as we don't guard it anyway.


Mexico does, though... :(
Whitebacon
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#12 Posted on 10.2.05 1611.28
Reposted on: 10.2.12 1612.43
I'm sure a little bit of American cash goes a long way in getting a Mexican border guard to turn their head though.
eviljonhunt81
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#13 Posted on 10.2.05 1637.13
Reposted on: 10.2.12 1637.35
    Originally posted by Pool-Boy
      Originally posted by redsoxnation
      I suggest the draftees use the Mexican border, as we don't guard it anyway.


    Mexico does, though... :(


Good thing the President got on this.
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#14 Posted on 10.2.05 1657.30
Reposted on: 10.2.12 1657.58
The Vietnam Quaker networks are still in place, so I'm not worried. I could be in Costa Rica tomorrow if I made a few phone calls.

God Bless the Friends.

-Jag
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#15 Posted on 11.2.05 0052.54
Reposted on: 11.2.12 0054.16
Call me an idiot if you must, but the notion of dodging a draft is sick. And not only for the fact that it'll be reinstated on the fifth of never.

Now I know that some of you must be thinking "good for you, that's your views, why should everybody else join". I offer this. If you skip the draft, and come home for the holidays, how do you look the man who lost an arm in combat because he didn't have the resources to flee the country in the eyes? I'm sure he had every intention not to join up and fight. And be he did it because it was his duty or he did it because he couldn't hide, he still stood up and took action.

This is the home team, fellows. Uncle Sam gets himself in a jam, somebody has to stand up and fight for him. To those who would say "it's not my war, I didn't vote for...", I say bullshit. Check your wallet again. Guess who's currency you're using. Telling a maniac who wants to kill Americans that they got the wrong guy because you voted against Bush isn't going to work. Do I want to go to war? No, a thousand times no. Being told that I'm going to carry a rifle around and get shot at is right up there with testicular mutilation. However, if a time came that somebody told me my uniform was in the mail, come to the draft center, I wouldn't duck or dodge out of the way. It could be the family history (both my Father and my Grandfather, and all their brothers served at one time or another), it could be just plain stupidity, it could even be some warped heroic fixation due to years of reading comic books, but damned if I step aside so that some poor schmo can take a bullet for me.
TheBucsFan
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#16 Posted on 11.2.05 0112.13
Reposted on: 11.2.12 0112.22
    Originally posted by Lexus
    Call me an idiot if you must, but the notion of dodging a draft is sick. And not only for the fact that it'll be reinstated on the fifth of never.

    Now I know that some of you must be thinking "good for you, that's your views, why should everybody else join". I offer this. If you skip the draft, and come home for the holidays, how do you look the man who lost an arm in combat because he didn't have the resources to flee the country in the eyes? I'm sure he had every intention not to join up and fight. And be he did it because it was his duty or he did it because he couldn't hide, he still stood up and took action.

    This is the home team, fellows. Uncle Sam gets himself in a jam, somebody has to stand up and fight for him. To those who would say "it's not my war, I didn't vote for...", I say bullshit. Check your wallet again. Guess who's currency you're using. Telling a maniac who wants to kill Americans that they got the wrong guy because you voted against Bush isn't going to work. Do I want to go to war? No, a thousand times no. Being told that I'm going to carry a rifle around and get shot at is right up there with testicular mutilation. However, if a time came that somebody told me my uniform was in the mail, come to the draft center, I wouldn't duck or dodge out of the way. It could be the family history (both my Father and my Grandfather, and all their brothers served at one time or another), it could be just plain stupidity, it could even be some warped heroic fixation due to years of reading comic books, but damned if I step aside so that some poor schmo can take a bullet for me.


At what point do you stop doing whatever you're told simply because "it's the home team?" If you're told to cut off your right arm because the government says it's somehow good for America. are you going to do it? I guess I have all this backwards, but I was under the impression that what makes (the concept behind) America so great is the idea that I can't be forced into something like this, that I have the right to question and even protest my government.

Blind patriotism and a feeling of absolute submission to your country isn't just stupid, it's dangerous. "Are you comparing Bush to Hilter?!?" heart attacks be damned, I'll say this: Nazi soldiers were serving there country and I'm sure many did it begrudingly out of a sense of duty.

If you don't believe in the war, I say you have a RESPONSIBILITY to not fight, otherwise you are giving your endorsement to an idea you think is wrong, and if you are not willing to stand up against that idea, then how will it be defeated? If, say, your brother was found to be a child molestor - and he showed no remorse for it - would you fight to convince people child molestation was OK out of family loyalty? What's the difference between selling out one principle or the other?

(edited by TheBucsFan on 11.2.05 0735)
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#17 Posted on 11.2.05 0919.59
Reposted on: 11.2.12 0920.08
    Originally posted by eviljonhunt81
      Originally posted by Pool-Boy
        Originally posted by redsoxnation
        I suggest the draftees use the Mexican border, as we don't guard it anyway.


      Mexico does, though... :(


    Good thing the President got on this.


Because the U.S. Border Patrol is supposed to keep people in the U.S.? Especially draft dodgers? I'm trying to figure out how this article is relevant to redsoxnation's post. Pool-Boy's post makes even less sense.
Nag
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#18 Posted on 11.2.05 1133.53
Reposted on: 11.2.12 1135.31
    Originally posted by Lexus



If the situation warranted a draft, I would not object. If China decides to go imperialistic on pacific, with sites inevitably sets on our interests, one should lay down there life if called upon, as I do believe in death over slavery. If North Korea drops the bomb somewhere in this world, then it's your duty as a man. If Osama Bin Laden is running around the neighborhood, the government shouldn't need to pick up the telephone, you should be after his ass with rifles and pitchforks, I don't care the situation.

I'm sorry I don't feel as strong about "humanitarian" missions. Giving the Iraqi's the right to vote is nice and all, and I'm sure they will enjoy wal-mart, but we only got one life to give, so at least I'm not going to act so enthusiastically altruistic. You can't stand in someones face waving old glory questioning people's motives over this one, but maybe I was misinformed.

I know at least few guys over there, a guy I grew up with and had wrestling matches in my backyard died last year, and I hold them in the highest regard. If I dodged this hypothetical draft, these guys could call me coward, yellow, unpatriotic all free of charge. Yes, I would walk away with my head down, but the trade-off is, I would still walk.
Lexus
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#19 Posted on 11.2.05 1142.29
Reposted on: 11.2.12 1144.59
At what point do you stop doing whatever you're told simply because "it's the home team?" If you're told to cut off your right arm because the government says it's somehow good for America. are you going to do it? I guess I have all this backwards, but I was under the impression that what makes (the concept behind) America so great is the idea that I can't be forced into something like this, that I have the right to question and even protest my government.

You do, and who am I to not implore that right. However, when you turn your back on the people and let them clean up the mess, you're no better than some scumbag exploiting the working class for financial gain. You're using the American public. Consciencious Objection is fine, dare I say noble, don't get me wrong, but when you're packing your shit because you're afraid, that's just weak.

Blind patriotism and a feeling of absolute submission to your country isn't just stupid, it's dangerous. "Are you comparing Bush to Hilter?!?" heart attacks be damned, I'll say this: Nazi soldiers were serving there country and I'm sure many did it begrudingly out of a sense of duty.

German soldiers under Nazi rule did it begrudgingly. The Nazi's wanted war. Furthermore, I am not prey to blind patriotism, and definitely not absolute submission. I appreciate what is so good about this country, such as our right to discuss this while wolfing down a triple cheeseburger and a soda so obscenely large that I'll make 3 bathroom breaks before I finish. I dislike what sucks about this country, namely not being wealthy.

If you don't believe in the war, I say you have a RESPONSIBILITY to not fight, otherwise you are giving your endorsement to an idea you think is wrong, and if you are not willing to stand up against that idea, then how will it be defeated? If, say, your brother was found to be a child molestor - and he showed no remorse for it - would you fight to convince people child molestation was OK out of family loyalty? What's the difference between selling out one principle or the other?

I fail to see any connection between 'let's go get the guys who have nukes too' and child molestation. We have nukes, they have nukes, aren't these the guys we should be starting shit with? And no, I would not go out and convince people that child molestation was okay. However, I would NOT abandon my brother, which is the point I tried to make to begin with, just because he's a down and out fuck up. I would do everything within my power to find him help, not up and flee just because I'm afraid of sitting at the same table.

Dodging a draft is telling the U.S. Government that you don't believe in their war effort, it's true. But, you're also giving the next guy in line the shaft. Fact is, even if you don't go to war in a draft, there are those who will have to due to no other reason than they had no way out. I am not so arrogant as to think I am smarter than any of them, or that I'm upholding some dignity in letting somebody else go to die in my place. That would be corruption.

And I do believe this thread's gotten retarded.
LionJeetSingh
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#20 Posted on 11.2.05 1251.48
Reposted on: 11.2.12 1253.59
(deleted by CRZ on 11.2.05 1330)
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