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24.10.07 0355
The 7 - Pro Wrestling - RAW 12-13-04
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TopTenPro
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#1 Posted on 13.12.04 2210.25
Reposted on: 13.12.11 2213.01
RAW thinking..

The opening with Eric was a segment we should not have been able to turn from, but once they showed the wrestlers waiting backstage, I turned to Las Vegas. Now the fight back stage was uncomfortable, they (HHH and Edge) should have both beaten the hell out of Benoit and then go after each other. What we got was them hitting Benoit then awkwardly going after each other.

The match with Edge and Orton was good, but the crowd shows how over these two are not. I like Orton (sorry JEB), but that entrance is lacking a "face" feel to it. No "face" would come out and celebrate themselves like Orton does. Edge is a lost cause, pick a tag partner and go with them. I feel that Edge may have "jumped the shark" with his tag title reign with Hulk Hogan.

This was perfect for a Kane return tonight! Gene was an A-hole to the ladies, Lita was out there, but they choose to give us the "Undertaker mystery return(s)" I classify this as any time a person's pyro or/and music play without the person appearing. Not to put the Undertaker in a special category, but Kane is no Undertaker.

Backstage Christian, was going somewhere, maybe a tag title match, then enter Foley. Foley got a pop smaller than any I remember, Bobby Eaton got a bigger one! This seemed like a rushed cameo, although Eugene did make the best of it.

Evolution came out separate, again hinting to dissension. During the match it is clear the WCW (Flair,Benoit,Jerico) guys knew how to work the Southern crowd. HHH and Batista seemed to not be able to get the crowd into the match unless they were on defense first pin by a spinbuster since 1983 (made up date), that was impressive by Batista! HHH again with the dissension look in his eyes.

Foley is God! This angle went too far. The payoff was stupid, the Arabs' opinion is the same of Ric Flair.

It's time for MAVEN! what there is a double feature of Las Vegas? Be right back.
Wait a second, two black guys in one match in the South I am gonna watch this match! Who do you think they are promoting as tag team contenders, Christian and Tomko, or Maven and Tomko? Maven is definitely turning evil, the pink trunks (Adrian Adonis comes to mind) are definitely a sign of being evil. Stinger Slash! JR said Stinger Slash! The rumors must be true, the WWE are going to sign another 50 year old!

Another question, Why can't an airplane spin be related to Mike Rotunda?

Hunter is the best actor since Miss Jackie!

Batisita is too tall to hit Benoit. Jerico does not have a chance. Edge see Jerico's chance.

Orton wins.
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#2 Posted on 13.12.04 2213.13
Reposted on: 13.12.11 2213.16
God help us all, it's that time again.

Fighting evil by moonlight, winning love by daylight, never running from a real fight, because it is time to WAKE UP! It's also time for Raw, live from Huntsville, Alabama...and a Fashion Report, too!

Bisch, back in black leather jacket, black shirt, carrying the Title, nicely grey-haired, comes to the ring where he may speak. From the back, HHH, Edge and Benoit give some heated discussion re: who should have the Title. Oh man - Rosie probably hadn't had a chance to eat from that catering table. Fisticuffs ensue (utilizing said table), so Bisch books some matches (I wonder if they could hear him in the back hallway).

Edge, in sleeveless black "Edge" faceprint tshirt and black faceprint tights, vs. Orton, in red package-enhancing "Orton" undies with gold hip bolts. Chioda officiates, in the stripes. The crowd's all over Edge, even before the match. I like Edge's stubble - it gives him that greasy "loser" vibe, along with his hair...a little Raven-esque. Orton clotheslines Edge to the floor, so AdBreak gets a long-time-coming runin.

Cont. Orton's firmly in control, wrenching a headlock on Edge. But Edge pulls the heelish trick of using the referee as a shield, shifting momentum. Edge is so good as a heel- as good as a heel as he is bad as a face. Orton dropkicks Edge as he tries...something from the top rope. In return, Orton totally bellyflops a cross-body. RKO, countered, RKO->pin. A nice match.

Lazy Writers' Poll: What should Bisch do with the Title?

In the back, Flair psyches HHH. Batista arrives to supply reason and wisdom (not just a muscle-head). HHH believes the hype.

FOOTAGE! from houseshows over the weekend.

Whores on the loose. Whores in the ring. Whores with a phallic tshirt-shooting thing. Meanwhile, JR, in blue suit, shirt, tie, and black hat, and Lawler, in black sportscoat and red tshirt, commentate. Thank God Snitsky is out to the ring. Hail Snitsky! How can you NOT laugh when Gene starts to shuffle? He's about to REALLY make my night when he starts to choke a bitch, but Lita has to come out and talk smack. Not even Snitsky can save this segment, now. Eventually Kane's coming back. Here's some pyro. (Apparently Kane has been working on his long-distance pyromancy during his vacation.)

HHH was in a movie. Here's FOOTAGE! of the debut.

Christian!, in the back, with makeup lady and Tomko, runs-into Eugene. Eugene talks about Cptn. Charisma, and Mick Foley shows up. Christian! gets no respect.

In Bisch's Room of Fun, Simon Dean signs a contract. Benoit barges in and he suggests a rematch of the Triple-Threat match. Bisch has a new, bald picture on the wall. Uncle Eric is watching.

Benoit, in black "4Real" tights with gold slashes and Jericho, in red "Jericho" silhoutte tights with pink/black rays, vs. Batista, in silver "Batista" undies with crotch flame and HHH, in black iron cross undies, with Flair, in grey suit. Hebner officiates. Hmm - no Evolution entrances anymore.... Flair, irate at Jericho's actions, almost interferes but the heels pull him out; they conference on the outside. AdBreak interferes.

Cont. Cheating heels dominate Benoit. Hot Jericho comes in and kicks heel butt. Batista powerbombs Benoit, getting the pin. Nice match. Post-match, HHH gives Batista a look, as Batista got the pin instead of him.

Mick Foley, in red flannel, shows FOOTAGE! of last year's SD! trip to Baghdad. He's going over with the boys again this year. To an ullullating entrance theme, AngryArab, in black suit, white shirt and tie, and AngrierArab (the short one), in tan suit, white shirt and tie, are out. The crowd "What"s them - that's not a good sign (although it sends me into titters). All involved shoot their mouths off. Mick challenges Angry to a match, but Angry declines.

FOOTAGE! of Lita/Trish from last week. Currently, Trish is interviewed in the back.

Meanwhile, Bisch talks to one of the whores. Edge barges in; he wants the title.

Maven, in Mylanta-pink "M" undies, and Christian! (this guy has had WAY too many entrance themes in his career), in white warmup suit with gold hood, sleeves, and trim, and Tomko, in black undies, vs. Regal, in black "Got Knuckles?" tshirt and red "England" undies, and Eugene, in jacket and blue undies, both wearing Tag Titles, and Shelton, in white undies with blue trim, wearing the IC Title. Chad "I'll allow it" Patton officiates the match. Eugene brings a Socko into the match; Christian! eventually uses it to choke Eugene.

In Bisch's Room of Fun, HHH asks, nicely - even using "please", that Bisch award him the Title.

Bisch comes out to the ring. Benoit, Edge, and HHH (with Batista and Flair) come out. WOO - Bisch books an Elimination Chamber match for the January PPV. Benoit vs. Edge vs. HHH vs. Jericho vs. Batista vs. Orton. In the meantime, the Title will remain held-up. The four EC contestants in the ring brawl. Then Jericho and Orton come down, too for some action.

Overall: This is more like it. After the last month of suck, this was finally a Raw I could enjoy.
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#3 Posted on 13.12.04 2216.36
Reposted on: 13.12.11 2217.57

Was I the only one that thought Maven was wearing McDonald's trunks when he first came out? Something tells me we'll get a Benjamin vs. Maven match at NYR.

The whole Hassan calling the troops gutless was just uncalled for. Yeah, I know it's all TV and an act, but there are some lines that, well, shouldn't be crossed.
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#4 Posted on 13.12.04 2219.51
Reposted on: 13.12.11 2225.04
If Maven is to fully complete his heel turn, he needs to get rid of that "Tough Enough Season One" music, and replace it with something more heelish.

Also, when Triple H began to beg for the title, I almost barfed up the string cheese I had just eaten. Hunter looked like a drug junkie, jonesin' for his next fix.
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#5 Posted on 13.12.04 2230.51
Reposted on: 13.12.11 2235.17
Really good show tonight with a storyline throughout that interested me. The last month of programming really dis-interested me, but I thought this show was good. Maybe Eric Bischoff means more to RAW then we all know.

Good matches with Orton v. Edge and Benoit/Jericho v. Hunter/Batista.

Well, for everyone who's been pining for the return of the elimination chamber, there ya' go. I'm glad they are using it so sparingly, though, as every other gimmick match (aside from the Royal Rumble) they have run into the ground to the point where people are burnt out. The elimination chamber was used once in 2002, once in 2003, and no times in 2004, so it's still something fresh and exciting.

Eugene's third favorite wrestler is Papa Shango? Awesome!

I'm not 100% sure how I felt with the Foley/Hassaan angle. A part of me thought it was done really well and another part of me thought it went over the line. I think a lot of it had to do with Foley's involvement as he did a good job of getting it over, so I guess that stopped me from totally hating it. I'll wait a few weeks before I fully pass judgment on the Mohammed character.

I'm digging the Maven heel-run. However, I agree that they need to replace his music, as I like it but it's too babyface.

Overall, a good RAW after a four week slump. Let's see if they can keep it up.

EDIT: Unforunatley, I missed the Snitsky segment (Damn Larry King, sucking me into the Scott Peterson debate). It sounds like it was either really funny or really stupid. Either way, it sounds like something I would have wanted to see.

(edited by OMEGA on 13.12.04 2334)
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#6 Posted on 13.12.04 2230.53
Reposted on: 13.12.11 2237.50
I didn`t know the Guest GM this week was going to be Burt Reynolds!

Thank goodness they realized Foley is the only one who can verbally debate the complexity of Hassan's gimmick...unfortunately, there really isn`t anyone else who CAN pull that off...so who will he feud with? Sgt. Slaughter?
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#7 Posted on 13.12.04 2231.02
Reposted on: 13.12.11 2238.00
How come Uncle Eric didn't show slides from the 4 Weeks of Visiting Strip Joints with the Wife Tour '04?
In terms of utter stupidity, the Hookers/Snitsky/Lita segment might rank near the top. Lita trying to make the save by having her music come on and talking to Snitsky while he's choking someone is really effective. Wouldn't saying Kane is coming back sooner have made more sense in order to get him to release the choke?
Only way they were going to get any interest in the Puerto Rico PPV 2 weeks before the Rumble was to hold up the belt.
If Batista doesn't win the belt in Puerto Rico, does Johnny Ace bring in his brother for a 1 time spot at Mania against Batista, as Jim Ross is close to giving up calling him Batista but instead The Animal. Battle of the Animals, and a side bar, they could bring in Mike Tyson to wrestle a bear.
I wonder if Eugene realizes Regal used to team with Bobby Eaton.
Funny how when its time to hawk merchandise, Foley decides to make an appearance. If he wants to come back, put him in a ring with Flair. That will make money.
I say dump the Arab gimmick just to get rid of the reappearance of the What? chant.
Trip talking about him on top being good for business was just hysterical.
Sad when Tomko would be a more legitimite I-C Title contender than the one they are going to push to face Benjamin.
Kane Is Ugly
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#8 Posted on 13.12.04 2233.24
Reposted on: 13.12.11 2238.01
Dude, the backstage thing with Eugene and Xtian ruled for one reason: PAPA SHANGO reference. Gotta love that.

And I think the wall of fire needs a title shot. That is more over than half the roster. Plus, this is the 2nd time in a row that a t-shirt gun was not used for a shot to the nuts. Thats disappointing.

BTW, what job can you take 4 WEEK vacation? And the last time I saw Eric was on the PPV and he only had like a small suitcase for clothes. 4 weeks on vacation would require a lot more to bring. Where the hell did he vacation anyway?

(edited by Kane Is Ugly on 13.12.04 2236)
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#9 Posted on 13.12.04 2247.31
Reposted on: 13.12.11 2247.56
Temptation island?
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#10 Posted on 13.12.04 2309.24
Reposted on: 13.12.11 2322.49
Good opening segment, which set the wheels in motion for the rest of the show. Plus, anytime I can hear Bischoff's music is a plus....The Orton/Edge match was pretty good- rarely does a RAW match got almost 20 minutes....I like the house show commercials- make them seem like they're worth going to, which most people don't think they are these days....The Snitsky thing was stupid. Sorry, but they seem to be stretching in terms of ideas of what to give the girls to do....

The Mick Foley appearance was a surprise, a rarity these days. And the mention of Eaton and Papa Shango was classic as well....The tag match was well-done, and I liked the job done in showing that Triple H wasn't really happy with Batista getting all the glory....Foley was great on the mic, and I was impressed with Hassan too. I guess this was his "debut", though most expected him to wrestle....

There wasn't much to the six-man. I would actually like to see a 10-15 minute six-man with these guys involved....I liked the announcement of the Elimination Chamber. Of course, who wouldn't. And the addition of Batista in it puts some intrigue into the match.....I hope people didn't tune in to see Bischoff award the belt to someone or to see Hassan's first match. If they did, they were sorely disappointed.
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#11 Posted on 13.12.04 2314.30
Reposted on: 13.12.11 2323.44
Great RAW tonight... I didn't even turn away to watch CSI tonight.

A few things that got a laugh out of me:

King on Benoit's teeth: When he smiles, it looks like his tongue is in jail.

King on Eugene: You want to know why Eugene was so special in 3rd grade? Because he was 18.

Also, during the Main Event, King made reference that Jack Doan was filing suit against the WWE over being hit by a chair last week?? I wonder if it's real or storyline stuff. But then again, they did say that HHH was going to be fined because of it. So, I'm thinking it might be storyline driven.

I've also decided that the WWE has taken this Arab angle too far with me. Not that it's not PC, but because the guy just talks too friggin' much. I'm at the point of 'Shut the hell up, wrestle and get off my tv'. He's annoying to me now.

I'm glad HHH finished the 'Joey Tribbiani School for Acting' because I swear he was pulling on his pubes to conjure those crocodile tears.

Edge and Orton was awesome tonight. Sorry the crowd didn't seem that into it because all those near finishes and new moves they broke out were great. I'm damn proud of them after that match.

(edited by Ticamo on 14.12.04 0413)
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#12 Posted on 13.12.04 2319.25
Reposted on: 13.12.11 2323.57
During the Snitsky segment, I was wondering why the heck all the faces were just sitting backstage cleaning their fingernails or whatever (I know, I know, no one actually watches the show unless it's important to the plot). Why not have, say, Shelton Benjamin run in to save Christy? It's not like he's doing much of anything these days. But then, I figured, maybe it's some kind of clever metacommentary -- they're hinting that the wrestlers care as little about these broads as we do.

As for the Muhammad Hassan segment ... jeez, they really want to get that poor sap lynched, don't they?

Maven's pink shorts were deeply disturbing. I'm not sure why ... something to do with that particular shade.

That aside, good Raw, with some matches (Edge/Orton and the semi-main) that were pretty darn good for free TV. Looks like Trips has been taking some acting lessons while doing Blade -- that "what the fuck just happened?" expression on his face after Batista got the pin was priceless.
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#13 Posted on 14.12.04 0000.48
Reposted on: 14.12.11 0001.06
There were so many rest holds in the Edge/Orton match tonight, there were moments when I couldnít tell if they were wrestling a match or taking a nap together. And what has happened to Edge? He just hasnít been the same since the injury. Itís not that he canít work well in the ring. Itís not that he canít talk well. Whatís his problem? He used to be respectably over. Now heís a total heat sucker. Pretty soon, they're going to tell him to sing Oh Canada before his matches, and then in no time heíll be off to move into Lance Stormís spare bedroom in Calgary. And Orton needs to do something HYOOOGE to cement his somewhat precarious over-ness. The Elimination Chamber might be the place to do it. If he can give us a performance like he did in his hard core match with Foley, then hopefully that will help him get his other leg over the babyface fence. But, Edge, címon manÖdo something.

I think I might like this Hassan guy. He seems to be getting his rap down pretty good, but I think his manager is dead weight and will only slow him down, though. Iím not sure I like where his gimmick is heading. I was disappointed they gave him some ďforeignĒ-sounding entrance music. The gist of his gimmick seems to want to fuel Anti-Arab-American sentiments, which I donít think is a good thing. And I always find it odd when the crowd chants a dissenting ďUSA! USA!Ē at an American (hello Rob Conway). Okay, so Hassan says Arab-Americans have been the object of unfair scrutiny and discrimination since 9-11. Foley disagrees. What exactly is he disagreeing with? Isnít it true? Other than that, Foley did the best he could with a bad angle. Props to him. And props to him for supporting the troops even if he doesnít support the war. I just hope theyíre leaving a little room to tweak Hassanís gimmick a little. I think it needs tweaking. I like the angry young man thing, I just wish it didnít reflect so badly on him in a racial way. What I was hoping they would do with him was somehow allow him to prove that heís just as much a normal American as anyone else. Maybe thereís still time. And I really was hoping to see him wrestle tonight. Might we have to wait till after the new year?

Iím liking heel Maven. Heís got a great smirk. And yeah, I also think he needs new music. I think I like him more now, after his heel turn, because now he at least HAS a character. Heís not the Tough Enough winner anymore. Now heís a wrestler. Somehow turning heel has made him more legit. Now all he needs is a better finisher than the fluke roll-up. He needs to go out there with a bomb up his sleeve and kick some ass. Canít someone teach him a finisher? Please?

What follows is an open letter to Simon Dean: Dear Simon, Iím sorry. Iím sorry youíve worked so hard for so long to get this big break and to fulfill your dream of being a professional wrestler in the WWE. Iím sorry youíve busted your ass and poured your heart into it, and when you finally get the Emerald City that is the WWE, Vince McMahon, the Great Oz of wrestling, does not give you courage, does not give you heart, does not give you brainsÖ he gives you the worst gimmick since Glen Jacobs was Isaac Yankum. If I have any words of solace, those words would be ďsilk purseĒ and ďsowís earĒ. See if you canít make the best of it. All best, Stilton.

If Triple H doesnít get an Oscar for Blade Trinity, he should at least get an Emmy for tonight. That was some Dawsonís Creek style acting at its finest. He donít wanna wait.

And while weíre at it: Batista dominates! He is casting his juiced-up shadow over the WWE. He has taken ALL the steroids. He has left none for anyone else. His nuts are now mere sunflower seeds. He walks among giants and says, Howís the weather down there? Triple H canít believe how one man can be so manly. And now he has his title shot at New Yearís Revolution! Soon his face turn will be complete, and he will take his rightful place at the side of the EmperorÖerÖ I mean, in the mid-card, next to Shelton Benjamin.


(edited by Stilton on 14.12.04 0107)
Big Bad
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#14 Posted on 14.12.04 0209.47
Reposted on: 14.12.11 0218.45
Say hello to Hassan and Daivari, aka La Revolution '04. OF COURSE the WWE wasn't going to be able to handle a concept like this with any kind of tact whatsoever. There are a million things that could've been improved with tonight's segment; first off, Hassan could've responded to the USA chants by once again pointing out that he's American, and acknowledged the "What?" chants by mocking them....something like "You want to know what? As usual, the misfortune of Arab-Americans falls on deaf ears." Foley could've said something like "I agree, it was shameful how Arab-Americans were treated after 9/11." Hassen thinks he's got an ally on his side, and then goes into his anti-troop spiel, but then Foley breaks in and says while what happened to Hassan was bad, badmouthing the soldiers isn't any better. Then the 'Foley Island' bit could've taken place as it happened.

As it stands, this angle doesn't really offend me in the sense that they crossed the line...that ship sailed long ago when the belt was around Sgt. Slaughter's waist. It just disappoints me that WWE took yet another interesting character idea with depth and warped it to fit Vince's narrow view of what a WWE superstar should be. I'll save final judgement until I see Hassan actually wrestle (if this guy is a good worker, that can overcome a lot of faults), but so far, the Arab-Americans have been a big miss.

The rest of the show, incidentally, was pretty good. I like how WWE isn't beating us over the head with the gradual Batista turn; Ross and Lawler didn't even acknowledge the death-stare that HHH was giving Batista for stealing his thunder. It was also a subtle touch with HHH begging Bischoff for the belt, but it was kind of a weird scene. HHH didn't beg outright or cry, since it would've likely devalued his character too much (since lord knows HHH can't show any ass). He also didn't immediately turn off the tears once Bischoff made his decision, so it looked like he was being genuine rather than just another trick from the Game.

So NYR looks like this....

* Elimination Chamber: Orton vs. Batista vs. HHH vs. Edge vs. Jericho vs. Benoit

* Shelton Benjamin vs. Maven

* Regal/Eugene vs. Christian/Tomko

* Snitsky/Kane

* Lita/Trish rematch

* Uh....Hassan vs. somebody? Rhyno? Venis?
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#15 Posted on 14.12.04 0732.09
Reposted on: 14.12.11 0733.58
I'm not getting all this love for Edge/Orton. It was a pretty bland match. Plodding start, the ridiculous double dropkick spot, the submission stuff in the middle that meant nothing. The finish was OK, but overall that match was a cure for insomnia. HHH/Batista vs. Benoit/Jericho was much better.
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#16 Posted on 14.12.04 0736.31
Reposted on: 14.12.11 0737.00
    Originally posted by The Great Thomas
    Also, when Triple H began to beg for the title, I almost barfed up the string cheese I had just eaten. Hunter looked like a drug junkie, jonesin' for his next fix.



All that segment was missing was HHH standing outside of Bischoff's office holding a boom box over his head playing Peter Gabriel.



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#17 Posted on 14.12.04 0845.57
Reposted on: 14.12.11 0847.40
Its obvious that HHH is going to get the title back. I mean, if it was, as they put it, vacant, then why does the title belt still have Trip's nameplate still on it? Wouldn't it be blank? Come on WWE, sheesh get with the program here.

And why is it, when I enjoy a RAW episode, you all hate it, yet when I find it sucked(tonight) you all praise it?

Strange.
dwaters
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#18 Posted on 14.12.04 0900.22
Reposted on: 14.12.11 0903.29
Why do they keep going back to the cartoonish "evil foreigner"?
It is so PLAYED OUT. Been there. Seen that.
One of the real reasons I enjoyed the "Attitude" era so much is they didn't insult us with evil Russian/Japanese/Iraqi heels.
It was rebel employee vs. evil corporate boss, polished arrogant Jock vs. ragged but loveable guy (Rock and Foley) OK, Undertaker stayed cartoonish, but it somehow still was acceptable.
I was hoping they'd do something different and make Hassan a misunderstood face, but it looks like we're in for more of the same old stuff.

(edited by dwaters on 14.12.04 0700)
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#19 Posted on 14.12.04 1019.53
Reposted on: 14.12.11 1020.26
How can you people jump for joy over the Papa Shango reference (Mrs. Tracker: "WHO?!") and not drop an honorary Alabama Jam off the couch for Bobby Eaton's name? What is wrong with you people?

A fun show.

I believe this is the second straight week that RAW has featured a shirt-gun appearance, and no one has blasted in the crotch. It really ruined the Gene skit for us. We were both yelling at the divas, "Why are you cringing? SHOOT HIM!"

Batista ... I tell you. He could be the next Next Big Thing. He's got the tools and just needs a few new moves.

Much to my shock, Mrs. Tracker digs Eric's new look and digs it mightily.

Both Edge and Christian are fulfilling their distinct level roles by losing all the time, and it's getting old. Orton's lack of activity during the SS GM's stint made me appreciate Edge more as a performer, yet Orton vaults back to the lead face role as we move toward the Chamber match. Obviously Benoit deserves the spot -- not because he's the online darling -- but because he's been the workhorse for RAW this year. You see the same on SD with Taker/Eddy.
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#20 Posted on 14.12.04 1020.54
Reposted on: 14.12.11 1023.53
(deleted by CRZ on 14.12.04 1527)
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