ParagonOfVirtue
Salami
Level: 32
   
Posts: 65/225
EXP: 201483
For next: 4961
Since: 20.8.03
From: New Jersey, USA
Since last post: 2806 days
Last activity: 2487 days
|  #1 Posted on 7.1.04 2112.09
Reposted on: 7.1.11 2113.26 | The Flair thread had me wondering about what they'll include on the WCW DVD. Undoubtedly, most of it will be a documentary about how the WWF is the greatest company ever created, and WCW got lucky a couple of times and then died like all other promotions do.
For the documentary portion, I'd expect it to be basically Vince, Big Show, Jericho, and Foley talking about how godawful the company was, while Bischoff would say how he did some innovative things but ultimately, Mr. McMahon proved to be God.
It's difficult to determine which clips they'll show because they run the risk of promoting wrestlers and other people the WWE does not associate with or want to acknowledge the existence of. Namely Vince Russo himself, whose ego would blow up times 100 if they mentioned him by name or by video. I expect them to say "A former WWE writer took over WCW to try to beat his former employer, but he sucked"..and that concludes the Vince Russo era. Even though this was the striking blow that ended WCW for good.
Here are the extras I'm guessing they could/should put on, excluding stuff like Luger's debut, Russo's world title win, anything that shows Jarrett in a positive light, RuBisch era, etc which however important, they won't put on for obvious reasons. It's possible they'll put in clips of those in the doc though.
Rise:
Some early WCW clip with the Horsemen, Sting
First WCW Nitro with Hogan vs Traylor
Hall debuts
Bash at the Beach '96
Madusa trashing belt
Hogan vs Goldberg
Fall:
DX invades WCW (heh)
Finger poke of doom
Arquette world title win
Last Nitro Flair/Sting
Last Nitro Vince promo, then Shane buys WCW
Of course, if I were putting this together it'd be a lot different, but I'm being realistic as to what World Wrestling Entertainment and Vince McMahon as a company would put out.
Short of Terra Ryzing matches, what else could you see WWE acknowledging that deserve to be on a WCW rise and fall compilation? Keep in mind it's only one-disc, so nothing too obscure. | Promote this thread! |             | Gugs
Bierwurst
Level: 82
Posts: 854/1857
EXP: 5043321
For next: 165928
Since: 9.7.02
From: Sleep (That's where I'm a viking)
Since last post: 15 hours
Last activity: 15 hours
| AIM: |  |
| | | Y!: |  |
|
|  #2 Posted on 7.1.04 2255.49
Reposted on: 7.1.11 2256.04 | WWE can't accurately portray the rise and fall of WCW, because WCW rose because it did the exact opposite of WWE: the cruiserweights were given loads of time and the same people weren't running the main event. And the nWo angle. WCW fell because it imitated WWE: cruisers were treated like crap and every week it was the same people fighting each other. And the nWo angle.
Lost in Cleveland (am I the only one who's never seen it?)
First Nitro
Hall defects
New World Order formed (first time)
Rise of Goldberg
Goldberg vs. Hogan
Cruiserweights
Last time Nitro beat Raw
nWo splits
Goldberg puts his arm through a limo
Vince Russo
David Arquette wins WCW Title, turns heel
Final Nitro
| headlock
Cotto
Level: 16
Posts: 15/47
EXP: 18893
For next: 1364
Since: 24.12.03
From: seattle
Since last post: 3333 days
Last activity: 3330 days
| #3 Posted on 7.1.04 2259.35
Reposted on: 7.1.11 2259.48 | In the "rise" section of this dvd the WWE could promote current WWE superstars who spent a portion of their career in WCW. Benoit, Foley, Jericho, HHH, etc, etc...you all know the list. It could give newbie fans an insight into what we all watched while it was happening.
The "fall" disc is odvious. They could have former WCW stars who worked with the company to the end. Booker, Steiner, Flair, Kidman, etc, tec you know the list.
I wonder if they'll actualy show entire matches. It could be neat to see if the WWE puts over any ex-WCW stars who aren't currently employed with them.
If done right it could be a good dvd. I'll check it out.
| Jericholic53
Boerewors
Level: 41
Posts: 88/378
EXP: 448170
For next: 31979
Since: 18.3.03
From: Honolulu, HI
Since last post: 257 days
Last activity: 1 day
| #4 Posted on 8.1.04 0010.19
Reposted on: 8.1.11 0010.25 | Originally posted by gugs
Lost in Cleveland (am I the only one who's never seen it?)
i've never seen it either, and i'm perfectly fine with that. i wouldn't mind seeing the matches/feud leading up to foley's 'amnesia'. from all accounts, it was definitely one of wcw's shining moments. | A-MOL
Frankfurter
Level: 56
Posts: 722/777
EXP: 1367186
For next: 30999
Since: 26.6.02
From: York, England
Since last post: 3356 days
Last activity: 3298 days
|  #5 Posted on 8.1.04 0347.03
Reposted on: 8.1.11 0348.17 | Originally posted by Jericholic53
Originally posted by gugs
Lost in Cleveland (am I the only one who's never seen it?)
i've never seen it either, and i'm perfectly fine with that. i wouldn't mind seeing the matches/feud leading up to foley's 'amnesia'. from all accounts, it was definitely one of wcw's shining moments.
I think Cactus Jack v Vader with the powerbomb on the concrete is on the upcoming Foley disc-set. | GRL
Merguez
Level: 54
Posts: 398/718
EXP: 1211807
For next: 22070
Since: 13.7.02
From: Austin
Since last post: 8 days
Last activity: 7 hours
| #6 Posted on 8.1.04 0606.11
Reposted on: 8.1.11 0607.01 | Didn't the Confidential episode paint the fall of WCW as being mostly Bret Hart's signing's fault? About how WCW misinterpreted his value to the wrestling world, but yet pushed him (heh) anyway?
I would love to see the WWE do this right and bravely: Include the clips of Luger and Madusa, Russo, Bischoff, Arquette, finger-poke, etc. | Aldo D 2112
Goetta
Level: 37
Posts: 131/302
EXP: 334026
For next: 4230
Since: 21.4.02
From: West Palm Beach, FL
Since last post: 2049 days
Last activity: 1878 days
| AIM: |  |
| | | Y!: |  |
|
| #7 Posted on 8.1.04 0750.11
Reposted on: 8.1.11 0750.58 | Two things to be added to the "Fall" section:
- How wrestlers such as Scott Steiner would make references to WWF/E superstars and bury WCW on-camera.
- Interviews with current road agents who worked for WCW (Arn Anderson, Fit Finlay, Dean Malenko, etc.) and have them talk about how "inmates running the asylum" helped speed up the decline.
| CANADIAN BULLDOG
Andouille
Level: 83
Posts: 1069/1962
EXP: 5309260
For next: 122984
Since: 5.3.03
From: TORONTO
Since last post: 28 days
Last activity: 27 days
| | ICQ: |  |
| |
| #8 Posted on 8.1.04 0914.48
Reposted on: 8.1.11 0916.56 | It will probably a longer version of two things: The 'rise and fall' pieces they did on Confidential about a year back (it's on the Best of Confidential DVD) and the history of wrestling WWE style, as seen at the starting of the nWo DVD.
You'll have comments from Bischoff, Flair, Nash, Booker Big Show, Jericho and anyone else who on the WCW side at the time and the usual cast of characters who were in WWE for the entire Monday Night wars (Stone Cold, HHH, McMahon, JR etc.) Nothing you haven't seen or heard a dozen times before.
What I'd much rather see is a best of WCW set. While its unfair to take their best stuff and boil it down to a half-dozen hours or so, this is better than yet-another WCW bashing vehicle AND it could make Flair DVD type of money. Here's what I would put on it (at least, ones that haven't already been put on previous or upcoming DVD collections).
Also, I'm going on the assumption that it would be just WCW, not the pre-1990 NWA stuff, just to put a timeframe on it:
- Sting vs. Ric Flair (Great American Bash 1990; although that could have been NWA still, I can't remember)
- Doom vs. Arn Anderson and Barry Windham (Streetfight, Starrcade 90)
- Sting and Lex Luger vs. The Steiner Brothers (SuperBrawl '91)
- Brian Pillman vs. Jushin Liger (think this may have been Christmas Day 91, believe it was televised)
- Lex Luger vs. Ron Simmons 2/3 falls (Hallowe'en Havoc 92)
- Ric Flair & Arn Anderson vs. Hollywood Blonds (2/3 Falls, Clash of the Champions 1993)
- Nasty Boys vs. Cactus Jack/Maxx Payne (Slamboree, I believe?)
- Ricky Steamboat vs. Rick Rude (Iron Man Match, Beach Blast)
- Team Sting vs. Dangerous Alliance (War Games, Fall Brawl)
- Raven vs. Diamond Dallas Page vs. Chris Benoit (forget what show that was on, thinking it was Thunder)
- Chris Jericho vs. Dean Malenko (don't remember the PPV)
- Goldberg vs. Hulk Hogan (Nitro, 1997?)
- Bret Hart vs. Ric Flair (Souled Out, 1998)
- Bret Hart vs. Chris Benoit (Tribute Match, 1999 Nitro)
Then for the features, you could do a year-by-year recap between 1990 and 2001, what the major angles were, etc., have wrestlers comment on them looking back, etc. | SKLOKAZOID
Liverwurst
Level: 68
Posts: 566/1200
EXP: 2656009
For next: 72805
Since: 20.3.02
From: California
Since last post: 1 day
Last activity: 1 hour
| AIM: |  |
| | |
| #9 Posted on 8.1.04 1108.42
Reposted on: 8.1.11 1110.42 | There are so many reasons why WCW fell to begin with that it's really hard to pinpoint it on one. Except to blame Eric Bischoff himself for not having a firm hold on storylines and, ultimately, not pleasing his fanbase.
I think signing Bret did have a lot to do with the downfall, but it wasn't the big thing that put them over the edge. Bret was thrust into the limelight right away in WCW and didn't have anything going on and, when he did, it seemed more like he was in the way of the wrestlers WCW had built up from 1996-1997.
I think a lot of Bret's failures in WCW can be attributed to Hulk Hogan pulling the strings, though. Bret came in, thinking he'd get his big dream match with Hulk Hogan, which Hogan used to shift titles away from guys like Sting, DDP, and Goldberg (the three WCW homegrown stars who actually drew) so that the big "Hogan/Bret" match could happen, and ultimately didn't. | CANADIAN BULLDOG
Andouille
Level: 83
Posts: 1070/1962
EXP: 5309260
For next: 122984
Since: 5.3.03
From: TORONTO
Since last post: 28 days
Last activity: 27 days
| | ICQ: | |
| |
| #10 Posted on 8.1.04 1116.20
Reposted on: 8.1.11 1116.24 | I don't think Bret Hart can be blamed; he's just an example of the mismanagement at the time. He could have been huge but Hogan and others decided that wasn't in the cards. They did nothing in the way of character development, yet flip-flopped him so many times that it didn't really matter whether he was part of the show by the end.
For whatever it's worth (and not much at that), I blame Time Warner. THEY could have developed a proper structure when things started going wrong. THEY could have taken a more hands on approach to making it turn a profit. And THEY certainly could have decided to keep the show on their network, ensuring that the company would have been run a separate entity (eg Fusient). But Time Warner did none of that, and all the other problems stemmed from there.
That's why I think a `rise and fall of WCW' DVD is pointless. Bischoff will blame people at Turner for not selling him the company. The wrestlers will blame the lack of a structure, and Bischoff, and Russo. So what? Everyone already knows that. If we're going to take a look back, I'd much rather see the GOOD things about WCW. | jk
Chorizo
Level: 27
Posts: 3/150
EXP: 107536
For next: 8624
Since: 5.1.04
Since last post: 3109 days
Last activity: 2943 days
| #11 Posted on 8.1.04 1314.14
Reposted on: 8.1.11 1316.02 | WWE can't miss the perfect chance to shit on the opposistion:
NWA-TNA's biggest star JEFF JARRETT vs. WWE's biggest star ever HOLLYWOOD HULK HOGAN
and Jarrett lays down - Bash at the Beach 1994?
Would love 2 see some matches with Booker T, Steiner, Cactus Jack, Kidman, Mysterio and other stars. They'll try to keep it too WWE Stars:
*Hulk Hogan vs. Goldberg, Nitro 1997
*Hulk Hogan vs. The Giant (Big Show), Hog Wild 1998?
*Chris Jericho vs. Rey Mysterio, Souled Out 1998
and the usual Ric Flair, Scott Steiner, Kidman, Cactus Jack, ect without including the big opposition in a big like except maybe Sting and Luger.
Should be gud as I am young and never saw a lot of WCW besides what is on DVDs like Confidential and NWO. | | ALL ORIGINAL POSTS IN THIS THREAD ARE NOW AVAILABLE |
| | | | | | | | | | | |
