Von Maestro
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|  #1 Posted on 6.1.04 2236.29
Reposted on: 6.1.11 2237.07 | Hi, I guess I've lurked long enough. I'll try to maintain the quality level of discussion usually present on the board :-)
I've read you guys discuss the errors in judgment that various politicians have made in the past (Trent Lott's scandal comes to mind), & I'm actually surprised that no one has brought this up yet...
http://story.news.yahoo.com/ news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/ 20040107/ap_on_go_co/ hillary_clinton_joke_3
A couple of questions come to mind that I'm interested in getting other people's opinions on:
1) Is this worthy of getting offended over, or is it PC run amok?
2) If this had been a Republican senator, would the coverage & public outcry be greater? | Promote this thread! |             | The Goon
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|  #2 Posted on 6.1.04 2308.12
Reposted on: 6.1.11 2309.46 | It amazes me that someone in public office could make this joke-it's just a stupid stereotype more than a hateful expression, but you have to wonder what she was thinking.
You're probably right. A Republican senator would most likely get a bit more stick for the exact same joke. | eviljonhunt81
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|  #3 Posted on 6.1.04 2322.39
Reposted on: 6.1.11 2323.30 | | I've already said this, but I couldn't figure out what was racist about the joke at first. In St. Louis, most gas stations are run by black or white people, not Indians, so the it took some time for me to realize that she was referencing that stereotype. I thought it was just some attempt at absurdist humor. | PalpatineW
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| #4 Posted on 6.1.04 2359.38
Reposted on: 7.1.11 0000.25 | Originally posted by eviljonhunt81
I've already said this, but I couldn't figure out what was racist about the joke at first. In St. Louis, most gas stations are run by black or white people, not Indians, so the it took some time for me to realize that she was referencing that stereotype. I thought it was just some attempt at absurdist humor.
Would have been much more accurate had she referenced MLK or Harriett Tubman or something. | MoeGates
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| #5 Posted on 7.1.04 0042.22
Reposted on: 7.1.11 0043.15 | 2) If this had been a Republican senator, would the coverage & public outcry be greater?
You know, it's the weirdest thing. For the longest time I thought the political rule was "the people who are (stereotypically) supposed to not say/do/think whatever bad thing they said/did/thought will get the most flak"
For example, Democrats are supposed to not be racist. Republicans are supposed to not cheat on their wives. Therefor, a Democrat making a racist remark is more politically damaging than a Republican doing so, and a Republican getting caught cheating on his wife is more politically damaging than a Democrat getting caught. This seems to make sense, as it seems to cost them the most votes in a logical world.
But actually the opposite is true. It's more damaging for a Republican to get caught saying something racist (witness the Trent Lott/Robert Byrd comparison). And it's more damaging for a Democrat to get caught cheating (Witness the Bill Clinton/Newt Gingrich comparison). Why? Because the relevant interest groups - say the NAACP and the Christian Coalition in our little test cases - will provide political cover for political allies, and won't for people who aren't policial allies. A Democrat who says something racist, but votes with the NAACP, is going to have the NAACP going to the press to excuse/forgive/play down the statement.
Ditto for the Republican getting caught cheating and the Christian Coalition - when I went and heard Ralph Reed talk, he got asked the question "how can you support Newt Girgrich given the very un-Christian way he's lived his personal life?" to which Reed responded "We're voting for Speaker of the House, not for Pope."
At the end of the day, every interest group in Washington D.C. will take the votes over the principle. I'm still torn on whether this is good or bad. | Grimis
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| #6 Posted on 7.1.04 0601.55
Reposted on: 7.1.11 0603.08 | I didn't hear about it until last night, and still couldn't figure it out.
Of course, if this were Bill Frist I'd have seen it ad naseum as he was stoned by the literati... | AWArulz
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| #7 Posted on 7.1.04 0758.28
Reposted on: 7.1.11 0758.44 | I hadn't heard about it until I read it here and read the link, a minute ago...
So I am thinking this was just like last Monday night at Raw. Time to Blog!
Hillary will be forgiven by her allies. I suspect she could use the N-word and get away with it. I think Moe has it pegged on that front. | Von Maestro
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| #8 Posted on 7.1.04 1029.37
Reposted on: 7.1.11 1029.51 | Originally posted by MoeGates
2) And it's more damaging for a Democrat to get caught cheating.
While I hear your point on non-PC speech being more "forgivable" when it comes from a Democrat, I'm not sure I agree with your point about an adulterer suffering more politically if he's a Democrat.
Without getting into all of the details about Clinton/Monica, that basically came down to a matter of perjury not adultery. It was basically well known that Clinton had cheated on Hillary before his initial election in 1992. I hardly see being elected to two terms as President as "politically damaging"... | OlFuzzyBastard
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| #9 Posted on 7.1.04 1050.11
Reposted on: 7.1.11 1050.33 | Originally posted by Von Maestro
Originally posted by MoeGates
2) And it's more damaging for a Democrat to get caught cheating.
While I hear your point on non-PC speech being more "forgivable" when it comes from a Democrat, I'm not sure I agree with your point about an adulterer suffering more politically if he's a Democrat.
Without getting into all of the details about Clinton/Monica, that basically came down to a matter of perjury not adultery. It was basically well known that Clinton had cheated on Hillary before his initial election in 1992. I hardly see being elected to two terms as President as "politically damaging"...
That's because normal people don't give a shit about any of this stuff. They vote based on who they'd rather have a drink with. | Von Maestro
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| #10 Posted on 7.1.04 1053.45
Reposted on: 7.1.11 1055.13 | Originally posted by OlFuzzyBastard
That's because normal people don't give a shit about any of this stuff. They vote based on who they'd rather have a drink with.
I don't know if I'd classify the people who vote like that as "normal", but I will say that sadly many voters decide that way... :-/ | oldschoolhero
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|  #11 Posted on 7.1.04 1243.25
Reposted on: 7.1.11 1252.50 | | Actually, I'd vote for whomever I tihnk would do the best job, and just because Clinton had a problem keeping his dick in his pants doesn't mean he ain't that guy. Still, that's irrelevant seeing as I'm a dirty great Brit. Carry on! | | ALL ORIGINAL POSTS IN THIS THREAD ARE NOW AVAILABLE |
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