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The 7 - Pro Wrestling - Survivor Series thoughts
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OlFuzzyBastard
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#1 Posted on 16.11.03 2157.29
Reposted on: 16.11.10 2159.01
HHH jobs clean. Molly Holly retains. Chris Benoit cleanly defeats the WWE champion. Whatever will the smarks complain about?
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ShotGunShep
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#2 Posted on 16.11.03 2201.36
Reposted on: 16.11.10 2202.20
    Originally posted by OlFuzzyBastard
    HHH jobs clean. Molly Holly retains. Chris Benoit cleanly defeats the WWE champion. Whatever will the smarks complain about?

Wow, the RAW 5 on 5 match was freaking good. Props to Shawn Michaels, WOW!
KANE came out to finish of the TAKER!!!! WOW!!
GREAT PPV.
And then came the Main Event. HHH vs Goldberg. Now, I must admit, I am probably the biggest(out of the 4 of us) HHH fan on here. I really really thought he was gonna win. Boy was I surprised. Oh well, that match was really stupid. Why have all of Evolution come out? It really didn't make Goldberg look like a badass. They all went out with one shot to the gut with the sledge. God I hate that man.

Great PPV, CRZ, ya shoulda go this one. Vince's blade job alone was almost worth it! That guy is FREAKING crazy!!!


EDIT: Forgot to mention this. But as an ORIGINAL CENA MARK (OCM) I was very pleased to see John FU the Show. Cena vs Show, US Title feud?!

(edited by kgriffey79 on 16.11.03 2013)
Texas Kelly
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#3 Posted on 16.11.03 2208.54
Reposted on: 16.11.10 2209.52
Holy shit... the first thing, looking at this show, is how incredibly fucking well-booked it was. When was the last time you've seen that in a WWF pay-per-view?

Goldberg/HHH: I'm still delirious over witnessing HHH do the right thing. (Granted, he should have done this with Jericho a year and a half ago, but at this point, I'll take what I can get.) There's so many more things that the WWF can do with Goldberg still having the belt than HHH having the belt. I'm glad to have been wrong on this.

Vince/UT: Booked perfectly. UT's WM retirement match against Kane is now on the books, and the match went the only way it could have gone - there's no way the fanbase would have bought Vince dominating for even a second of this one.

Bischoff/Austin: I would have rather seen Orton go over RVD (to set up an IC title feud) or Jericho go over Michaels, but they sent Austin packing, which is the right move. He can head to Smackdown, come back as a wrestler in a few months and really wreck some havoc, or sell his soul to Bischoff and go corporate. I can't wait to see the outcome.

Bashams/Guerreros: Thank god they didn't turn Chavo. Someone on the 411 Roundtable made a really good point: Instead of feuding them, keep 'em both face, elevate Eddie, and move Chavo in with the cruisers.

Kane/Shane: Would've preferred fewer big spots from Shane and more domination by Kane, but Kane's big role on this night was in the Vince/UT match anyway, so it ultimately means little. What are they gonna do with Shane now, though?

Molly/Lita: Putting off the big Lita title win will only make it that much more of a markout moment when it does happen. WM, anyone?

Angle/Lesnar: Shouldn't have been the opener, but the Holly/Lesnar thing was handled beautifully, Benoit makes Brock tap, and Cena prepares to take the US title from Show. If Goldie/Lesnar is on for WM, I can't see either man having a belt then... could it finally be Benoit's time?
OMEGA
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#4 Posted on 16.11.03 2219.03
Reposted on: 16.11.10 2220.23
No complaints from me. A little dissapointed that Noble/Tajiri was pushed to Heat, but considering the PPV ended about 5 minutes before 11:00, it only made sense.

Team Angle d. Team Lesnar:
VERY odd to see this go on first. Glad to see them get rid of most of the dead weight early. They booked this right, with Benoit going over Lesnar, and Cena getting the winning pinfall.

Molly Holly d. Lita:
YAY! I SOOO wanted Molly to go over, but I didn't think it'd happen. But it did! Yay! No offense to Lita, or anything.

Kane d. Shane:
Good for what it was, I guess. If it ends the feud, I have no complaints.

Bashams d. Guerreros:
Just what I expected. It was rushed, but still good. Eddie v. Chavo seems to be next.

Team Bischoff d. Team Austin:
GREAT match! Yay for Shawn, who really made this match what it was. Suprised to see Booker get eliminated first for his team. Excellent match.

Good job building the emotional Austin departure. It would have worked better, however, if people actually took stipulations seriously, anymore.

Vince d. Undertaker:
Pretty bad, but short, so whatever. Kane v. Undertaker seems to be penciled in for WrestleMania.

Goldberg d. Triple H:
EXCELLENT booking for Goldberg here. With one leg, he took out all of Evolution, and beat Triple H cleanly. Way to go! Let's just hope they continue building Goldberg like this, because (for tonight, at least) they finally got it right.
Shem the Penman
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#5 Posted on 16.11.03 2220.48
Reposted on: 16.11.10 2221.07
I'm a bit mixed. There were a lot of slow, dead spots -- they couldn't have saved Austin's farewell for Raw tomorrow? Why waste so much time on the Coach/Bischoff/Mark Cuban/Orton bit? But there were also some pretty good matches to be had.

I really wish Noble/Tajiri had gone a little longer. It's a PPV (okay, it's a pre-PPV Heat) -- give the guys a few more minutes. Solid match, though, and Jamie blocking the green mist was cool. By the way, who was that "Rue" woman who was doing the pre-show with Josh? Day-YUM.

Team Angle/Team Lesnar was weirdly booked -- it felt like they went into the match with no other plans but "Let's give Cena and Benoit a little time to shine." Not that I object to that, and they rose to the occasion, but why have all those other guys in the match if you're not going to DO anything with them? And a big thanks to Nathan Jones for the laugh when he once again fell on his ass after doing his big boot.

Shane/Kane: And once again Kane spends virtually the entire match selling for Shane and letting him hit all the highlight reel spots until the Tombstone at the end. I was half dreading that Shane would fight out of the Tombstone somehow. Yeah, Kane got the win, but he also got to look like crap while doing it. And this is supposed to build him up for a feud with the Undertaker?

Guerreros/Bashams: Oh boy, the "Eddie and Chavo have problems" angle is going to continue. Good match, though, with the Bashams more than holding up their end. Putting Bashams in Demolition's old harnesses is a sound fashion choice, too.

Team Austin/Team Bischoff: Match of the night, easily. Well-paced, well-worked (even RVD seemed to be putting some effort into it), and, despite the overbooking at ten end, dramatic. I'm amazed they'd even consider taking Austin off TV, but I'll be grateful for some time off from him, especially if he comes back as an actual wrestler.

Vince/Taker: Yeah, Vince bladed huge. That's about all I can say for this "match." Please do not let Kane come out tomorrow night and declare Vince his "Higher Power"....please.....

Goldberg/Trips: Damn. The one time I finally give in to my inner smark and say Triple H ain't going to job ... he does. Wonder if they're going to aim for an Armageddon rematch, because if they're planning to send Kane after Taker, or vice versa, there aren't many other opponents for Goldberg out there.
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#6 Posted on 16.11.03 2225.42
Reposted on: 16.11.10 2227.20
Shem: I'll let you figure out who should be taking the belt off Goldberg, and it's not Kane. Big Hint: It's a person on the heel side of the Raw ten-man who's not in HHH's sphere of influence.
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#7 Posted on 16.11.03 2228.13
Reposted on: 16.11.10 2229.01
Cena FU'ed The Giant Show?! Sweet!! Benoit makes Lesnar tap?!! Awesome!

*Love of WWE.....rising*
Mayhem
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#8 Posted on 16.11.03 2229.16
Reposted on: 16.11.10 2231.12

Pretty good PPV.

Okay, was it me or did the opener appear to be headed to clusterfuckville when Jones and Morgan were in the ring against Angle ... To me it looked that way, but Kurt kept things moving. God, Nathan Jones is horrible.

Wish that Noble & Tajiri would have been on the PPV instead of the Mark Cuban segment. But when your a bazillionaire NBA owner, you can get yourself onto PPVs.

Kane vs. 'Taker ... SWEEEEEET!

ScreamingHeadGuy
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#9 Posted on 16.11.03 2230.51
Reposted on: 16.11.10 2234.56
Well, two friends were over to watch the show. One is a "casual fan" and the other hadn't really watched wrestling since Hogan/Andre. The end result - a dang fun time was had by all.

Team Angle vs. Team Lesnar - fast action, with the early eliminations serving to get rid of the "chaff".

Guerreros vs. Bashams - Nice action; I was surprised that Chavo was the one to cost them the match. The Bashams debuted their new He-Man-style vests of studded leather (with cuffs).

Shane vs. Kane - This just kept going on. Honestly, it wasnt' bad, but it just wouldn't end. Oh, and the production troubles weren't nice.

Lita vs. Molly - Good action here. King uttered "puppies" only once.

Team Bischoff vs. Team Austin - YES! This match had me "ooh"ing and "aah"ing. I would rate this match as excellent-to-classic. I hope they can follow-up on this tommorrow. I give HBK's blade job 3 stars (of 5 - he only got half the face coated).

Taker vs. Vince - This was brutal, in the ass-kicking sense. Everyone here was thinking Nick Patrick would just stop the match, Vince was bleeding so badly. Vince's blade gets 4.5 stars.

HHH vs. Goldberg - A nice match. By this point, I was emotionally spent.

Overall: A show that will make you glad to be a fan. (Well, except for the 7-minute waste of time that Mr. Cuban was.)

Fan Fashion: We had two John Cena cosplayers (back to the camera, front row) and red-hat/open blue shirt man had LOTS of sings.
CruelAngel777
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#10 Posted on 16.11.03 2233.18
Reposted on: 16.11.10 2235.01
    Originally posted by Texas Kelly
    Shem: I'll let you figure out who should be taking the belt off Goldberg, and it's not Kane. Big Hint: It's a person on the heel side of the Raw ten-man who's not in HHH's sphere of influence.


Mark Henry?
Dawg
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#11 Posted on 16.11.03 2252.53
Reposted on: 16.11.10 2254.55
Solid PPV. The blood from both HBK and McMahon was fairly amazing I'd say.

So, I wonder if the Cuban segment will do what it was intended...to get a mention on ESPN? I know ESPN loves to talk about the antics of Cuban and all.
Staplegun
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#12 Posted on 16.11.03 2257.02
Reposted on: 16.11.10 2258.52
The WWE Survivor Series? a great PPV!? no way! The Goldberg and Lesnar confrontation was great, and The Bischoff/Austin match was pure genius. PPV of the year hands down, excellent booking, but the main was a bad match, but at least Goldberg went over, even though i didn't think he would. great show, and i actually got goosebumps when there was an explosion, and out came Kane. thumbs up WWE.
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#13 Posted on 16.11.03 2258.47
Reposted on: 16.11.10 2259.01
Good show all around. Like someone said earlier, not a ton for smarks to complain about, at least fundamentally. A few thoughts:

- Noble v. Tajiri was actually one of the highlights of the night. Well-booked, fast-paced and I was disappointed it was relegated to Heat.
- Pleasantly surprised that the Angle v. Lesnar elimination match was kept as short as it was. And they totally went with the right decision leaving Cena and Benoit in there at the end.
- Kane-Shane II was done right, for once. They didn't make The Mighty Shane O'Mac look like a giant-slayer (throughout the match at least) and it worked well. I half-expected him to reappear at some point in the night, breaking free from his hospital shackles. I guess that's what tomorrow night is for, though.
- Team Austin v. Team Bischoff was near-perfect. Shawn Michaels, hopefully, silenced everyone here who've been bemoaning his value to the company lately. Not only did he pull out an excellent match, but told an excellent story as well. Not too many left on the roster who can do that. And, surprisingly, Mr. Humble didn't stick around afterwards for the post-match accolades.
- Goldberg and Brock make initial contact, and it was subtle. Good show! If they keep going that course to WrestleMania, I love how simply they started the whole thing.
- The only good thing I'll say about Undertaker-Vince is that at least McMahon didn't dominate the match. Was that fake blood he was using? I'm serious. Michaels' color was somewhat realistic, but McMahon's blade job just seemed -- a little unreal. Okay, one other good thing: It's setting up for Kane-Undertaker at WMXX, and while I'm no fan of that particular match, give them credit for advance planning.
- It's great that we moved on to the main event and all, but isn't there any concern that a human being is kind of BURIED UNDER MOUNDS OF DIRT a few feet away? Geez, at least feign a bit of concern there, guys...
- Goldberg going over HHH surprised me, what can I say? I just hope there isn't a rematch tomorrow night.

Not a bad PPV at all. They turned things up a notch, and it showed.
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#14 Posted on 16.11.03 2310.40
Reposted on: 16.11.10 2311.55
    Originally posted by Dawg
    Solid PPV. The blood from both HBK and McMahon was fairly amazing I'd say.

    So, I wonder if the Cuban segment will do what it was intended...to get a mention on ESPN? I know ESPN loves to talk about the antics of Cuban and all.


I wouldn't be surprised to see it on Sportscenter. THen they will see Randy Orton's RKO and never watch wrestling ever again.
ThreepMe
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#15 Posted on 17.11.03 0006.43
Reposted on: 17.11.10 0011.11
Damn, makes me wish I saw the PPV.

But after reading the Results, makes me wonder if WWE read my suggestion about Kane and Taker...

Oh, I hope.

Threep's Kane/Taker Fantasy Booking

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#16 Posted on 17.11.03 0028.18
Reposted on: 17.11.10 0029.01
no such thing as a smark...

good swerve on the lita/molly match, although they had to kill molly's main finisher and one of lita's secondary ones to do it.

10-man matches were fine and dandy as Brock would say.

benoit and cena prevailing was nice.

RAW was fine although HBK-NESS dominating the end was a bit much.

crap on a stick gimmick matches. you could almost see shane pull out a list "elbow? check. shaneomacinator? check."

Also the gamenken fury was a bit much, especially vince blading on the first one.

cue chavo turn i guess.

wow, a million chop blocks etc. and goldie sells fairly well.

Phantom
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#17 Posted on 17.11.03 0029.40
Reposted on: 17.11.10 0030.05
    Originally posted by CruelAngel777
      Originally posted by Texas Kelly
      Shem: I'll let you figure out who should be taking the belt off Goldberg, and it's not Kane. Big Hint: It's a person on the heel side of the Raw ten-man who's not in HHH's sphere of influence.


    Mark Henry?
Nope. If you remember, Mark Henry was going in pursuit of HHH's nickels.

And Jericho is HHH's designated jobbing bitch.

No, the man who should be taking Goldberg's belt is none other than... CHRISTIAN!!!
Hogan's My Dad
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#18 Posted on 17.11.03 0033.37
Reposted on: 17.11.10 0034.28
I don't want to be a wet blanket (then don't says a smart-ass reading) but I gotta say this.

I think Shawn Michaels is great. I really do. No one in their right mind is going to say Shawn isn't a brilliant performer, one of the absolute best ever in the wrestling business. But he shouldn't have been booked the way he was tonight. Yes, he did a great job, but that's not really the point. He's a part-time wrestler. Most of what he did tonight was bleed and get the shit kicked out of him. Booker could have done that, Booker was the first to join Team Austin and the unacknowledged leader. He got the big cage dive spot. All the subtext was screaming he was the big gun. Why is he the first guy off his team? I'm really tiring of this. RVD, another guy Trips buried but still remains over, was next. Why? What good are the Dudleys doing? Shawn gets to play Superman and falls just short of the mark against, who? His enemy, his nemesis: Chris Jericho? Y2J, the leader of Team Bischoff? No! To Pool-Boy. Orton, who has yet to put in a single impressive performance in his career.

All so Austin can fake-retire for the third time inside of a year?

Again, nothing against Shawn. Great talent. But it's not his time. He's not the guy to book that strong when you have two other guys right fucking there who actually work house shows.

I'm extra-pissed about this because it was such a fine fine match. Just a great match, but it was booked all wrong. I can't stand it sometimes. I think I'm giving up on RAW completely, because what I don't enjoy, I'm force-fed, and what I do enjoy, I'm not allowed to.

As for Vince. This match was disgusting. I don't know who they think all this blood appeals to, but when they book this kind of gore they alienate a lot of people. I don't want to see people bludeoned like that, and certainly not on a weekly basis. I'd like to see a 6-month vacation to all blading.

Shane/Kane was pure anti-climax.

The SD elimination was good, not as good as the RAW one, but good.

Molly/Lita was fine for what it was, which wasn't much.

Guerreros and Bashams had a nice one. Very entertaining, but I think Eddy's star is starting to fade. He's entering, "what's the point of getting behind him, he'll never do anything" territory that is the domain of RVD, Jericho, and Booker now.

Trips/Berg was fine, well-booked, and was the breather I needed from the constant force-feeding of Triple H and everyone he's associated with being the centerpiece of the universe. I'm just glad he lost and I'm looking forward to him going away for a while.

A good show with crappy booking decisions, IMO. I hope I didn't give the impression I just hated everything. It was mostly good, but I just could not biologically disagree more with the way they booked that RAW elimination.






(edited by Hogan's My Dad on 16.11.03 2237)
Mike Sweetser
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#19 Posted on 17.11.03 0050.48
Reposted on: 17.11.10 0051.41
Shawn Michaels sure wrestles quite a lot for a "part-time wrestler".

Mike
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#20 Posted on 17.11.03 0058.12
Reposted on: 17.11.10 0058.38
    Originally posted by Mike Sweetser
    Shawn Michaels sure wrestles quite a lot for a "part-time wrestler".

    Mike


Every RAW and every PPV is still only a third of the shows WWE does. He's not on the road, that's my point.
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