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The 7 - Site Bashing - Dave Meltzer and the word "gay"
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Karlos the Jackal
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#1 Posted on 8.8.03 0640.30
Reposted on: 8.8.10 0642.17
From Meltzer's NWA TNA recap:

[Jerry] Lynn threw a temper tantrum that made him look so gay (for those who need close captioning, gay is not to mean homosexual, but a slang term for, well, weak, impotent and basically everything a babyface shouldn't look like)

Oh, come on. That's like calling someone a "retard," and then saying, "Of course, 'retard' doesn't refer here to being 'retarded' -- it's just a slang term meaning 'really fucking stupid.'"

Furthermore, if he feels the need to follow his use of the word with a lengthy clarification, why didn't he just say, "Lynn threw a temper tantrum that made him look weak and impotent."? Is he trying to show off his mastery of contemporary youth lingo?

Confused,
--K
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gargs
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#2 Posted on 8.8.03 0817.28
Reposted on: 8.8.10 0819.20
I believe Eminem used the same excuse when he was confronted about the lyrics in his raps. He said that "fag" to him, doesn't necessarily mean anything derrogatory towards homosexuals, rather he is trying to take away another person's manhood and insult that person. Actually through his rambling (and defense of himself), he didn't make the word seem any better than how it was used in the raps.

Those type of references usually makes the person sound intelligent...like Lord Dazzington.

(edited by gargs on 8.8.03 1230)
fuelinjected
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#3 Posted on 8.8.03 1351.57
Reposted on: 8.8.10 1352.06
I'm glad he explained it or I would have taken it as, "Lynn threw a temper tantrum that made him look so happy." :)
BigDaddyLoco
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#4 Posted on 8.8.03 1647.52
Reposted on: 8.8.10 1648.43
You know that the majority of the internet treat Meltzer's word just like The Bible. Just like The Bible it's possible that enough net 'reporters' can turn it into a headline that reads JERRY LYNN BLOWS WRESTLERS FOR A PUSH!

Notorious F.A.B.
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#5 Posted on 8.8.03 1914.07
Reposted on: 8.8.10 1916.16
I've always thought Jerry Lynn was gay. Not the "impotent" gay -- the "I like cock" gay.

I've mostly come to terms with the words gay, queer and fag themselves. Most of the time they're used in a generic sense that isn't directly hateful. On the other hand, they describe a certain way of being and hammer in the notion that it's not okay to be like that. I wish people would come up with different words to use but the majority of masculine, manly-man males do think that being a fag is wrong. (Edit: and they're welcome to their opinions.)

(edited by Notorious F.A.B. on 8.8.03 1914)
JustinShapiro
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#6 Posted on 8.8.03 2016.06
Reposted on: 8.8.10 2018.43
But retard and gay *are* slang terms. Appropriate or otherwise. I don't think they're exclusive to contemporary youths either.
Karlos the Jackal
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#7 Posted on 8.8.03 2126.58
Reposted on: 8.8.10 2129.02
    Originally posted by JMShapiro
    But retard and gay *are* slang terms. Appropriate or otherwise. I don't think they're exclusive to contemporary youths either.


Yeah, but they're derived from something else, and reflect that -- they're not totally independent terms, which seems to be what Meltz is going to great pains to establish.

I mean, I wouldn't care if Meltzer said, "Lynn threw a temper tantrum that made him look totally homosexual."

But it really annoys me that he chooses to use the word "gay," knowing full well what the implications are, and then goes on to explain at some length why there isn't a connection after all. What is his purpose here?, I ask -- it obviously isn't clear and concise writing. So I'm just asking.

--K

(edited by Karlos the Jackal on 8.8.03 2311)
thecubsfan
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#8 Posted on 9.8.03 0033.51
Reposted on: 9.8.10 0037.42
>What is his purpose here?, I ask -- it obviously isn't
>clear and concise writing.

Of course - it's Dave Meltzer!

Dave's NWA-TNA stuff seems very much stream of conciousness, which probably caused this to slip in without much thought the first time, and it only being amended to on a second pass, when he couldn't think of a better word to describe the impression.

Either that, or the teenage kids his occasionally talks about have completely taken over his vocabulary.

Maybe Justin can buy him a thesaurus for Hanukkah
Eddie Famous
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#9 Posted on 9.8.03 0140.06
Reposted on: 9.8.10 0140.06

    Originally posted by Notorious F.A.B.
    I wish people would come up with different words to use


But Notorious One, the internet trolls DO have a different word to use - GAYE - comPLETEy different from gay of cuss....

A good rule of thumb is if you think you are going to offend someone by using a word, then either don't use it or don't care.
Notorious F.A.B.
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#10 Posted on 9.8.03 0247.04
Reposted on: 9.8.10 0248.04
I don't read the guy's stuff (first hand) and I already think Lynn is gay. (Or bi, which is close enough for most.) Is it possible Meltz is privy to that information and covered for using the word by throwing out the other definition?
J. Kyle
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#11 Posted on 9.8.03 0540.18
Reposted on: 9.8.10 0541.31
    Originally posted by Notorious F.A.B.
    I wish people would come up with different words to use
Joss Whedon tried that and what did he get? Aired out of order and cancelled swiftly.

However, that doesn't mean I can't try that too.

Here are my suggestions for new insulting terms
Old->New
--------------
Bitch->Gigli
Retard->Wachowski
Faggot->Armadan
Any Ethnic Slur->Spider-Man:Chapter One Otaku

(edited by AngryJohnny on 8.8.03 1742)
Net Hack Slasher
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#12 Posted on 9.8.03 1009.15
Reposted on: 9.8.10 1010.35
Personally I think it's classless and immature to use words like that to describe someone negatively.

Sincerely,
Jeremy Shockey, New York Giants

Why didn't he just say "weak" like in his bracket explanation of what his term of Gaye meant... Personally I think the phrase "Acting like a suck" would have done just fine. But then again LoL
AWArulz
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#13 Posted on 9.8.03 1046.01
Reposted on: 9.8.10 1049.30

    Originally posted by Karlos the Jackal

    But it really annoys me that he chooses to use the word "gay," knowing full well what the implications are, and then goes on to explain at some length why there isn't a connection after all. What is his purpose here?, I ask -- it obviously isn't clear and concise writing. So I'm just asking.

    --K

    (edited by Karlos the Jackal on 8.8.03 2311)



In my opinion, he was just trying to be hip. I hang with Jr High and High school students all the time in youth ministry and counseling and that is a frequent term that they use to mean Lame, outdated, uncool, ect. I fugure Da Meltz is just feeling his years and wanted to shoe he is still "with it".

The phrase doesn't offend me much, although I think it's rather insensitive. I understand kids using it, because they are still dealing with exactly who and what they are.It's hard to justify using it as an adult, unless of course, you're still dealing with adolescent issues of that sort.I don't know Dave, don't have a clue how old he is, but I figure 35ish. I'd think he'd be done dealing with that part of his life at this stage

Chico Santana
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#14 Posted on 9.8.03 1533.42
Reposted on: 9.8.10 1533.52
IMHO it's stupid to get this worked up over a word. Especially a word that has several meanings. Every Homosexual I have known tosses around the words fag and gay like they are trying to reach a quota. The only time I think it's wrong for these type of slangs to be used is in a hateful manner from a hetro person to a hetro/homosexual person. Or at work.

Hell, I think it's ok for a straight man to call another straight man a fag/homo/gay in a joking manner. People should be more secure in their sexuality, I'm a straight male and I could care less if someone calls me a fag, though I would be upset If some cockblocker told a girl I had the hots for that I was gay so he could slip the moves on her(but, that's because I would be denied of my civil right of a fare chance at ass!).

Furthermore these words were created with other meanings....
Fag:1)To work hard and become very tired 2)to serve as fag or servant/to employ (a boy) as fag or servant c)a boy in English public school who acts as a servant for another boy in a higher form. 2)[Slang] a male Homosexual
Fag:[Old Slang] a cigarette.

Gay:1)joyus and lively; merry; happy; lighthearted 2)bright; brilliant [gay colors] 3)given to social life and pleasures 4)Wanton; licentious [a gay dog] 5)a)homosexual.

The above are taken from a Webster New World Dictionary, but I also have a Harper Collins "American Slang" dictionary that has Gay as: homosexual and relating to homosexuals. The way Metzler is using gay is not in my slang dictionary though I have heard it used in the same style as he has. So Metzler is using gay in somewahat of a wrong manner, stick with me here. Gay and Fag both mean homosexual, though Fag also means to be a servant or lackey: a male servant of low rank. Low rank can = low standing and low standing can be seen as weak.

What have we learned? It would have been more proper for Metzler to call him weak........ or a fag. However he said Lynn was throwing a "temper tantrum", so he should have called it childish and this thread would not exist.
Shem the Penman
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#15 Posted on 12.8.03 0035.21
Reposted on: 12.8.10 0042.34
There was a similar affray on one of the old wrestling sites ... I want to say thesmarks.com, but I can't be positive. At one point in a puro recap, Justin Baisden described the Shining Wizard as a "faggot knee to the head," which provoked a Thread from Hell on the site's board as folks rushed to condemn the usage, Baisden refused to back down, other folks started supporting him, and of course eventually someone dragged out the dreaded phrase "political correctness" and it all ended in tears.

Me, I just think it's lazy. No, every high school kid who says "Dude, that's so gay" is not a future Rev. Fred Phelps, and I don't get too exercised about that sort of usage. But as others have pointed out, there are tons of better words and phrases to use to express the same meaning without also being slurs. And in writing, as opposed to speaking, you're able to -- and you should -- choose your words more carefully. Even when writing a message board post.
Eddie Famous
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#16 Posted on 12.8.03 0329.41
Reposted on: 12.8.10 0330.03

It ain't Shakespeare folks. Take a nap.
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#17 Posted on 12.8.03 1459.47
Reposted on: 12.8.10 1500.34
Funny thing is, when I first saw Meltzer interviewed in "Beyond the Mat," I thought, "Man, the guy is GAY." And, by gay, I mean, he eats the cock.
JustinShapiro
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#18 Posted on 12.8.03 1522.20
Reposted on: 12.8.10 1522.37
Whatev dude, Dave has a son. Bet you wish you could create people.
SomeRandomFag IV
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#19 Posted on 12.8.03 1530.34
Reposted on: 12.8.10 1530.46


    Whatev dude, Dave has a son. Bet you wish you could create people.


You know that *THEY* can adopt now.
spf
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#20 Posted on 12.8.03 1532.02
Reposted on: 12.8.10 1532.27

    Originally posted by JMShapiro
    Whatev dude, Dave has a son. Bet you wish you could create people.

This news really disturbs me. Is there anyone on earth who would put bets on this kid somehow being anything remotely close to normal?
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