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The 7 - Random - Grammar Freaks Talk to me!
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who__lame
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#1 Posted on 13.2.02 0146.42
Reposted on: 13.2.09 0159.01
Why do we say X is a mark FOR (say) Steve Blackman while
we say X is a fan OF Blackman?

both fan and mark are nouns right? Then why the difference
in usage?
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ironcladlou
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#2 Posted on 13.2.02 0203.50
Reposted on: 13.2.09 0205.04
Well....mark is nore of a carny-speak colloquialism. Slang can kinda create its own grammar. "Mark for..." can be appropriate, just like "CRZ is a worker for XO" not "of XO" as well.
Excalibur05
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#3 Posted on 13.2.02 0236.47
Reposted on: 13.2.09 0245.22
There's some implied action too. "Marking" is an action. Being a fan is not. Thus if one is a "mark for Steve Blackman", it implies that when one watches Blackman wrestle or sees Blackman buying cheese in the dairy aisle, then he/she would perform the act of marking out. (Gee that sounded alot less sick when I first thought it...)

If a person is just a fan of Blackman, then it doesn't imply any sort of action on thier part. If a person is a fan of say Test, it doesn't mean that they will cheer wildly every time they see Test, it just means that they enjoy Test...(Oh dear...)

Thus: One marks for Blackman, so one is a mark for Blackman

One does not fan of Test, however one is a fan of Test.

(edited by Excalibur05 on 13.2.02 1742)
MoeGates
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#4 Posted on 13.2.02 1204.01
Reposted on: 13.2.09 1229.03
If you say "I am a mark for Blackman," that makes Blackman the indirect object and "mark" the direct object. If you say "I am a fan of Test" that makes "Test" the direct object and "fan" a possesive of "Test."

However, if you say "I am a Test fan" or "I am a Blackman mark," then the word "mark" or "fan" is the possesive and "Blackman" or "Test" is the direct object.

So I gues the question is "why can the word 'mark' be used with an indirect object while the 'fan' can't?"

The answer is: I have no idea. I tried to figure it out but nothing really worked. Any ideas?

Moe
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#5 Posted on 13.2.02 1304.41
Reposted on: 13.2.09 1305.21
Because, as Excalibur said in so many words, Mark and Marking are verbs. I don't fan out for Angle, but I do Mark out for Angle. It's as simple as that.

Verbing words is fun, ain't it?

-jAg
MoeGates
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#6 Posted on 13.2.02 1409.34
Reposted on: 13.2.09 1412.15
But look at it this way. I can be a Test mark, and be a mark for Test, because as you say, "marking" is a verb. I can be a Test nut, and be a nut for Test, but "nutting" sure isn't a verb.

Moe
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#7 Posted on 13.2.02 1933.09
Reposted on: 13.2.09 1959.02

    Originally posted by MoeGates
    but "nutting" sure isn't a verb.

    Moe



It could be in a dirty way. A guy I used to work with use to say it in reference to his sexcapades. Funny guy. Anyone can make a noun a verb or anything they want it to be even if it doesn't make much sense. There was this published short story I had to read for one of my workshop classes that was full of nouns as verbs like "he Mountain Dewed to the mailbox." Trippy stuff.
Jaguar
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#8 Posted on 13.2.02 2301.16
Reposted on: 13.2.09 2303.51

    Originally posted by MoeGates
    But look at it this way. I can be a Test mark, and be a mark for Test, because as you say, "marking" is a verb. I can be a Test nut, and be a nut for Test, but "nutting" sure isn't a verb.

    Moe



Hmmm. There's something inherently wrong in the language :) Anyway... you being a Test nut/mark/fan sets you as the object (a mark/nut/fan) and being described by being for a nut for Test. Bleh, if I was an english major kind of guy I could say that correctly and in a simple format. Anyway, you can't be a fan for Test, unless you were being 'a fan, for Test'. So why can you be a nut for Test? Maybe if I say it like, "I'm a crazy person for Test". That works. But "I'm a crazy for Test" doesn't. Bleh, I'm utterly worthless in this thread, so I surrender.

-Jaggles
ironcladlou
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#9 Posted on 13.2.02 2327.54
Reposted on: 13.2.09 2329.05
It all comes back to the most versatile word in the english language: Fuck. Fuck has so many different connotations and grammatical uses, it's astounding.

Verb: "You don't always have to fuck her hard."

Noun: "You have got to be the dumbest fuck I've ever met."

Adjective: "Would you like to take a ride in my fuck wagon?"

Gerund: "I've really got to take a fucking pee."

That's not mentioning fucker, motherfucker, fuckface, ass-fuckingly, etc...

The point I'm trying to make is that if people started saying "I'm a mark of Test", then eventually, if enough people used it, it would become an accepted part of the language.
Zeruel
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#10 Posted on 14.2.02 0002.31
Reposted on: 14.2.09 0007.14
nutting = ejaculating
who__lame
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#11 Posted on 14.2.02 0032.46
Reposted on: 14.2.09 0044.30
I thought of 4 sentences last night which might or might shed more light on this and seems to bear Excabilur out. Here they are without explainations.

1a) I am an employee of IBM
1b) I am a worker for IBM

1a) I am an employee for IBM
1b) I am a worker of IBM

3a) I am a sucker for fruity-tooty lollypops.
32b) I am a sucker of fruity-tooty lollypops.

P.S Don't take these literally. ;-)
who__lame
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#12 Posted on 14.2.02 0032.46
Reposted on: 14.2.09 0044.30
I thought of 4 sentences last night which might or might shed more light on this and seems to bear Excabilur out. Here they are without explainations.

1a) I am an employee of IBM
1b) I am a worker for IBM

1a) I am an employee for IBM
1b) I am a worker of IBM

3a) I am a sucker for fruity-tooty lollypops.
32b) I am a sucker of fruity-tooty lollypops.

P.S Don't take these literally. ;-)
who__lame
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#13 Posted on 14.2.02 0032.46
Reposted on: 14.2.09 0044.30
I thought of 4 sentences last night which might or might shed more light on this and seems to bear Excabilur out. Here they are without explainations.

1a) I am an employee of IBM
1b) I am a worker for IBM

1a) I am an employee for IBM
1b) I am a worker of IBM

3a) I am a sucker for fruity-tooty lollypops.
32b) I am a sucker of fruity-tooty lollypops.

P.S Don't take these literally. ;-)
Dr Unlikely
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#14 Posted on 14.2.02 0844.37
Reposted on: 14.2.09 0850.39
It's not really about mark being a verb. Mark, in the carny sense that Lou mentioned above, is referring to the person being an easy target for someone to fool. So if you use "mark" in the pseudo-bastardized way that we tend to in this sense, someone who really likes Blackman is, in a sense, a mark for him, since the person would be more easily targeted by Blackman.

That Steve Blackman...is there anything he can't explain?
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