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The 7 - Current Events & Politics - my "Brits and the EU" thread reply for Grimis. Register and log in to post!
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-proletarian-
Chipolata
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#1 Posted on 25.5.03 1206.37
Reposted on: 25.5.10 1208.59
How can you make an unsubstansiated comment about the long term strength of the euro vis-a-vis the US dollar? Economics isn't an exact science, and even the most seasoned economists wouldn't be able to definitively say what the relative value of a currency will be down the road, so how you can make a statement such as that is beyond me. The fact is that you don't know what the value of the euro versus the dollar will be. None of us do. The only thing we CAN say is that right now, the euro is worth 20% more than the US dollar, rendering your comment about Europe meaning a weak currency worthless.

And I just KNEW that by throwing the Roman Empire in there you'd use that EXACT retort to my post. Come on, you can do better than THAT, can't you? The simple fact is that when you bring down trading barriers between nations and eliminate red-tape in the form of currency conversion, that can only be good for trade and economic development.

Honestly, I think that 90% of the Europe-bashing on this board comes from a fear that a united Europe would diminish American power and influence in the world. It's childish, and needs to stop.
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#2 Posted on 25.5.03 1627.11
Reposted on: 25.5.10 1628.42
I fear the EU, for one day (towards the end of my lifetime) it will become the WU. One big faceless, nameless, socialist politically correct world. Hopefully I'll be dead by then.
Grimis
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#3 Posted on 26.5.03 0844.31
Reposted on: 26.5.10 0852.37

    Originally posted by -proletarian-
    The simple fact is that when you bring down trading barriers between nations and eliminate red-tape in the form of currency conversion, that can only be good for trade and economic development.

It's great for trade and economic development in LESS economically developed countries. Just look at NAFTA and trade between the US and Mexico. Because of cheaper labor and the removal; of barriers thousands of US jobs are going south of the border. Hard to maintain a growing economy like this. The outsourcing of American jobs to other countries is why the economy is having a problem coming back right now.


    Originally posted by -proletarian-
    Honestly, I think that 90% of the Europe-bashing on this board comes from a fear that a united Europe would diminish American power and influence in the world. It's childish, and needs to stop.

No, all a united Europe would be would be a black hole for socialism and the natural totalitarian replacement in a Cold War for the USSR....
-proletarian-
Chipolata
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#4 Posted on 26.5.03 1125.23
Reposted on: 26.5.10 1125.42
Grimis, free trade isn't a one-way street. Yes, the junior partner (in terms of economic backwardness) gains in terms of labour-intensive work being moved from the high-wage economy into the low-wage economy, as has happened in Mexico. However, the more advanced country benefits too, in the form of the rapid economic development of it's less developed partner necessitating the purchase of capital goods needed to further boost productivity and continue it's economic growth. When Mexico's economy grows due to all the low-end work being sent it's way, it requires capital goods to fuel it's expanding and gradually more sophisticated economy. The United States is there to supply said equipment, and the trade-off is complete. Both sides benefit. Otherwise, do you really think anyone would ever sign free trade agreements with anyone?


And come on, really, Europe is a community of democratic nations. Europeans love democracy just as much as we on this side of the Atlantic do. The EU isn't the sinister, monolithic organization euroskeptics make it out to be, it's just a big, bloated bureaucratic money trap that regulates the curvature of bananas and the size of condoms, that's all. It makes me laugh when people tell me how Europe is sinking into dictatorship under the EU, the damn organization can't even cook the books properly! (if you read British news you'll know what I'm saying) How a bumbling organization like this is ever going to usurp the democracies of Europe is something I'd be very interested in seeing how they pull off......
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#5 Posted on 26.5.03 1141.21
Reposted on: 26.5.10 1142.28

    Originally posted by Grimis
    No, all a united Europe would be would be a black hole for socialism and the natural totalitarian replacement in a Cold War for the USSR....


Democracy + Democracy = Communism.

I guess I must have missed that lecture. In case it had escaped your attention, socialism in its pure form is a dying breed in many parts of Europe. Even the staunchest of socialists have shifted gradually toward a more centralist view in many countries.

In Britain we arguably no longer have a major socialist party.

Thatcher's tongue was not entirely in cheek when she said her greatest achievement was the birth of New Labour.
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