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The 7 - Pro Wrestling - Vince's love for big men?
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socetew
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#1 Posted on 14.4.03 1142.23
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1142.27
Many people complain that Vince gives too many belts and high-level feuds to 'tha big guys. But throughout the present and past, he has not shown any love (in terms of pushes) to the following big guys:

Bill DeMott
Mike Awesome
The Warlock
Adam Bomb
Henry Godwin
Duke "The Dumpster" Droese
Crush
Giant Gonzales
Vader
Mantaur
Bam Bam Bigelo (did he ever win any titles? I thought I remember him being held back)
Bastion Booger/Friar (Mike Shaw)

And there are probably other big men who were held back. You can claim that many of them sucked, but most were probably at least as good as the people who apparently suck who are getting pushes these days.

So there.
--eocs
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Tenken347
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#2 Posted on 14.4.03 1147.11
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1147.39
Bam Bam Bigolow and Tatanka had a cup of coffee with the tag titles.
jwrestle
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#3 Posted on 14.4.03 1147.42
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1147.58
Hmm...not much to say other than the Lumbering Giant Big Show has gotten of lucky to have what he has so far. Everbody else on the list pretty much hit tolets across the nation.
Underwater
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#4 Posted on 14.4.03 1154.36
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1154.48
OMG! MANTAUR WAS A VICTIM OF THE GLASS CEILING!!!!!1

DeMott's ANGRY and INTENSE cruiserweight killer push wasn't a push?

Awesome was too injured and broken down to ever get pushed. That and Paul didn't like him too much.

Vader was a main-eventer for awhile.

And really, was I missing all the wrestling fans worldwide calling out for the Bastion Booger megapush?
spf
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#5 Posted on 14.4.03 1156.37
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1156.57
The Warlord was given a run with either Hogan or Warrior IIRC. Crush was repeatedly given pushes near the top of the card, including the Savage feud. Giant Gonzales wrestled UT at WM in a match fairly high on the card I believe. Vader was supposed to win the title at Summerslam until Vince had a last second change of heart. Bam Bam first got the Jesus push on his debut until his overness seemed to scare Hogan, and then again he got a decent push to be a legit opponent to Bret Hart. And hey, he DID main event Wrestlemania ;)
Mandark
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#6 Posted on 14.4.03 1156.58
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1159.06
I'm not following you here, especially that last sentence.

The idea is that Vince McMahon and WWE in general tend to give more opportunities to wrestlers who are large, even if they have problems with charisma/wrestling/talking. A lot of times, this can make the product worse than it needs to be.

I don't think anyone would say that WWE promotes its wrestlers based only on size, but that would be just as wrong as saying size isn't an important factor.

If you want to get into making lists, there are way too many examples of the bigger workers being portrayed as superior to the more average sized workers and cruiserweights in WWE. Every promoter has his own style and certain preferences, and one of McMahon's is that he prefers large, muscular men.
SchippeWreck
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#7 Posted on 14.4.03 1157.49
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1159.07
Henry Godwin got a SERIOUS push as a tag wrestler (and a bit as a singles face) as a result of Vince's love for big men AND hillbillies.

And most of those guys on the list got a decent debut push, but then never ended up anywhere.
jwrestle
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#8 Posted on 14.4.03 1200.32
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1203.12
Sad thing is all I remeber of the last year of Vader in the WWE him was his continued loses to Mark Henry. That still didn't get Henry over hey why isn't he on the list?!?
commie_050
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#9 Posted on 14.4.03 1203.31
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1206.04

    Originally posted by socetew
    Many people complain that Vince gives too many belts and high-level feuds to 'tha big guys. But throughout the present and past, he has not shown any love (in terms of pushes) to the following big guys:

    Bill DeMott
    Mike Awesome
    The Warlock
    Adam Bomb
    Henry Godwin
    Duke "The Dumpster" Droese
    Crush
    Giant Gonzales
    Vader
    Mantaur
    Bam Bam Bigelo (did he ever win any titles? I thought I remember him being held back)
    Bastion Booger/Friar (Mike Shaw)

    And there are probably other big men who were held back. You can claim that many of them sucked, but most were probably at least as good as the people who apparently suck who are getting pushes these days.

    So there.
    --eocs



First, nearly everyone on that list, with the exception of Vader and possibly Bigelow) had little to no wrestling talent, and wore out their welcome quickly. A bunch (Warlock, Adam Bomb, Giant Gonzales, Crush) were pushed as dominant forces despite this fact. Gonzales is almost universally considered the worst main event wrestler of all time, but that stop him from having featured matches at WM and SS, as well as a dominating performance at the RR. Bigelow was scheduled from a main event run, but was cut down by the Clique. The rest were constrained by bad gimmicks.
redsoxnation
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#10 Posted on 14.4.03 1204.36
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1207.48

    Originally posted by socetew
    Many people complain that Vince gives too many belts and high-level feuds to 'tha big guys. But throughout the present and past, he has not shown any love (in terms of pushes) to the following big guys:

    Bill DeMott
    Mike Awesome
    The Warlock
    Adam Bomb
    Henry Godwin
    Duke "The Dumpster" Droese
    Crush
    Giant Gonzales
    Vader
    Mantaur
    Bam Bam Bigelo (did he ever win any titles? I thought I remember him being held back)
    Bastion Booger/Friar (Mike Shaw)

    And there are probably other big men who were held back. You can claim that many of them sucked, but most were probably at least as good as the people who apparently suck who are getting pushes these days.

    So there.
    --eocs






Let me go through each of these guys

Bill DeMott: Given a push as a destroyer of cruiserweights. Had been a lower mid carder in WCW, and his push in WCW was viewed as one of the signs the company was really screwed.

Mike Awesome: Injury prone, and was a 'big guy' in only the ECW sense of the word. Heyman never forgave him for screwing him over in ECW, and his injuries killed any chance for a push.

Warlock? (Warlord): Was pushed heavy as part of the Powers of Pain in late '88-early '89 after him and Konga the Barbarian jumped over from Crockett. Was awful in the ring.

Adam Bomb: Had a brief mini-push in the mid 90's. Developed more in WCW and had a long winning streak; a streak killed by Kevin Nash as he built himself up as a streak killer in late '98. Returned as part of KroniK during the InVasion. Was Buff Bagwell awful in his return.

Henry Godwin: Vince has a fetish for Hillbillies. Had a moderate tag team push as a member of the Godwins in the mid 90's.

Duke Droese: Wasn't very good. Came about during Vince's 'gimmick fetish' phase.

Crush: Had a high mid card push in the mid 90's, until his problems with the law. Returned as a member of the original Nation of Domination and DOA. After leaving for WCW, returned to the WWF/E as part of KroniK. Was Buff Bagwell bad on his return.

Giant Gonzales: He was tall. He was crap. He was tall. He was crap.

Vader: Main evented SummerSlam '96 after an intense push during the first half of the year. Had lost much of his intensity after the Hogan feud in WCW. Sealed his own fate after punching the interviewer in Kuwait. Injury prone at the end of the WWF/E run.

Mantaur: He was a lower mid carder.

Bam Bam Bigelow: Originally was pushed heavy in the WWF back in '87, as the search for his manager was a key topic in the WWF. Left for WCW after an unsuccessful push, and after initial success in WCW, flamed out quickly. Returned to the WWF/E in the early/mid 90's and main evented Mania XI.

Mike Shaw. Greatest success was in WCW as Norman the Lunatic. Was nothing special.

Dexley's Midnight Jogger
Pepperoni
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#11 Posted on 14.4.03 1345.42
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1346.52
I know he stunk up the ring, but I used to love seeing the Warlord back in the day, with his Phantom of the Opera mask. They should have kept the Powers of Pain together with that look, and the Barbarian's antler hat.
CANADIAN BULLDOG
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#12 Posted on 14.4.03 1354.30
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1357.19
I think that the point here is, Vince brought these guys in and gave them TV time because they were big and had a good look to them. It doesn't matter if they got belts and mega-pushes. McMahon seems to prefer a big monster in the ring as credible challengers, etc. to his main stars. That was the entire formula for all of Hogan's matches in the 80's. Sure, maybe One Man Gang or Kamala (or even Warlock) weren't given a serious chance at the belt, but they LOOKED the part, and that's what counts with McMahon.
y4j1981
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#13 Posted on 14.4.03 1413.10
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1413.10
I thought that I read somewhere that Bam Bam Bigelow didn't get a huge push cause he wasn't liked/or got into arguments with the Kliq. Of course the Kliq was in full power at this time, which is why they made Bam Bam job to L.T. on PPV.
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#14 Posted on 14.4.03 1417.01
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1417.04

    Originally posted by y4j1981
    I thought that I read somewhere that Bam Bam Bigelow didn't get a huge push cause he wasn't liked/or got into arguments with the Kliq. Of course the Kliq was in full power at this time, which is why they made Bam Bam job to L.T. on PPV.


There was NO WAY that LT was going to lose his WrestleMania match, no matter if he was against Bigelow, Undertaker, Bret Hart or ANYONE (ok, maybe not HBK)... That was a foregone conclusion, and I don't think it had much to do with his heat with the Kliq.
asteroidboy
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#15 Posted on 14.4.03 1655.34
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1658.00
Mike Shaw. Greatest success was in WCW as Norman the Lunatic. Was nothing special.

Was I the only one who marked out for Norman the Lunatic? I thought he was awesome, when I was a kid.

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#16 Posted on 14.4.03 1707.11
Reposted on: 14.4.10 1711.25
Yup....I always thought his stuff following Woman around while she just abused the hell out of him and ignored him was actually pretty good.....
darkdragoon
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#17 Posted on 17.4.03 1908.58
Reposted on: 17.4.10 1912.45

    Originally posted by socetew
    Many people complain that Vince gives too many belts and high-level feuds to 'tha big guys. But throughout the present and past, he has not shown any love (in terms of pushes) to the following big guys:

    Bill DeMott
    Mike Awesome
    The Warlock
    Adam Bomb
    Henry Godwin
    Duke "The Dumpster" Droese
    Crush
    Giant Gonzales
    Vader
    Mantaur
    Bam Bam Bigelow (did he ever win any titles? I thought I remember him being held back)
    Bastion Booger/Friar (Mike Shaw)

    And there are probably other big men who were held back.



DeMott has the cruiser squash/TE guy push.

Awesome was hyped and failed to live up to it in both WCW and WWE.

Vader destroyed Yokozuna before he was fed to Shamrock, Bradshaw etc.

That still doesn't excuse Ludvig Borga, Albert, Show, Nash, Nathan Jones, etc.

But Inoki etc. are nearly as bad, as Giant Silva, George Hines and a number of other big lugs are working over there.
SeVen ™
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#18 Posted on 17.4.03 1915.55
Reposted on: 17.4.10 1921.36
Vince didn't show Kurragan and Giant Silva much love. Not that I'm an advocate for big talent-less lugs stinking up the ring.
minextoo
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#19 Posted on 18.4.03 0559.00
Reposted on: 18.4.10 0559.01
I am not much for big guys, but every once in awhile one will catch my interest.


I think Vince REALLY dropped the ball with two of the bigges though. I figured if anyone can creat a monster heel out of a giant, it's Vince. So when Vader was signed I thought, that's it this guy is going to be as big as Hogan and Andre. Unfortunately he got fed to teh ego that walks at SummerSlam 96 and then to Sid later. You lose to Sid, then you're done for good -- thats like a rule or something.

Then he totally dropped the ball with Big Show. Here was a HUGE straw in the McMahon hat. For the first time in the Monday Night Wars, Vince had won a bidding war for a wrestler. I thought for sure Big Show would be this huge mega-heel and that an ultimate showdown between he and Austin would draw Hogan/Andre intensity and buyrates. Then he jobbed to Austin on RAW two weeks later. Two weeks in and Big SHow was history.

No wonder the guy is never motivated.
Mild Mannered Madman
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#20 Posted on 19.4.03 0109.08
Reposted on: 19.4.10 0111.30
    Originally posted by darkdragoon
    But Inoki etc. are nearly as bad, as Giant Silva, George Hines and a number of other big lugs are working over there.


You do realize you're using horrid examples in this regard, don't you?

Silva is already better than Big Show & Nash ever were. George Hines is about 6"2" and weighs around 240 lbs. Not remotely a big man.

Scott Norton would've been a better example.



(edited by Mild Mannered Madman on 18.4.03 2309)
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