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24.10.07 2205
The 7 - Random - It's official, Buffy to end this season.
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Cerebus
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#1 Posted on 26.2.03 1435.51
Reposted on: 26.2.10 1439.27
Taken from Yahoo News...

Stick a stake in it: "Buffy the Vampire Slayer" is done.
After seven years, the series will be over at the end of this season, said its star, Sarah Michelle Gellar (news).

"'Buffy,' in this incarnation, is over," Gellar told Entertainment Weekly magazine for its March 7 issue, her eyes welling with tears. The series will wrap up with a five-part story, which will include the return of Faith, the bad-girl slayer, and Buffy's first love, Angel.

...Nice to see Angel come back for an episode or two atleast.

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EddieBurkett
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#2 Posted on 26.2.03 1513.39
Reposted on: 26.2.10 1529.02
Perhaps a spoiler warning would have been in order, given the revelations contained therein. (Not that *I* didn't know, but...)

If she's so sad about the series ending (eyes welling with tears), how come she's the one that brought it about? If she wasn't in such a hurry to do movies, filling up her schedule and driving her cost/ep up, then maybe Buffy would be around another season and she wouldn't be so sad.

Should it bothers me that I like Buffy Summers as much as I don't like Sarah Michelle Gellar?

Oh well, at least we now know.
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#3 Posted on 26.2.03 1556.26
Reposted on: 26.2.10 1559.07

I really like Buffy, but I'm ready for it to go.

Watching the seasons 2 and 3 dvds have made me realize how good the show used to be and how it's really been not as good since then.

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#4 Posted on 26.2.03 2121.42
Reposted on: 26.2.10 2123.02
Not as good, but still good. I'll be sad to see the show go. But, there's always Angel, and whatever new series pops up.
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#5 Posted on 27.2.03 0059.36
Reposted on: 27.2.10 0102.45
I disagree with the assumption that Season 2 and 3 were the be all end all of Buffy. Season 2 only hit a high point with the Angelus storyline and that was only five episodes or seven depending where you start. Spike and Dru were cool, but they become secondary villians fairly quickly and by the middle of the season were stale. Season 3 was by far the best of the triligy, but that was mainly due to the fact that Season 2 had a fairly dark ending which lead to more plots and characters for the 3rd one to munch on. Season 3 was great mainly due to Faith and the Mayor chemistry and the three episodes of Zeppo, the Wish and Dopplegander and the finale. Season 3 only caught great when Faith turned.

Re-watching Seasn 4 made me realize, its not as bad as people say it is. Its more of light hearted season then the rest. If you watch it with Angel Season 1, it really is a great seson for both shows. To me Season 5, they hit rock bottom, but defiantly redeemed themselves with 6 and 7. I do think this is the best storyline season ever for both Angel and Buffy and I can't wait to see how it all plays out in the end.

A Fan- All Good Thing Must End.
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#6 Posted on 27.2.03 0516.24
Reposted on: 27.2.10 0517.06
To me, season five and six were the nadir, filled with turgid and one-dimensional storylines, progressing only one idea at a time with only one conflict at a time. Previous seasons incorporated many characters and issues in the format of new developments or demons that taxed or impelled all the characters in different ways.

And, as much as I love "Buffy," Sarah Michelle Gellar couldn't act her way out of an open paper bag with the help of a drama coach, a map and a how-to book. When (not if) her pretensions for a movie career fizzle out, she might be able to land the lead role in a pilot for "Mindless Unexpressive Blonde."
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#7 Posted on 27.2.03 0852.55
Reposted on: 27.2.10 0853.15
If this leads to an endless series of SMG/Freddie Prinze Jr. romantic comedies, I may get suicidal. I don't think we need another Simply Irresistible.
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#8 Posted on 27.2.03 1007.22
Reposted on: 27.2.10 1011.08
I'm sorry, but I just watched Season 2 over the last few weeks, and I have to say that is was WAY amazing and (w/ season 3) easily the highpoint of the show. (Not that I'm knocking the other seasons... Its like comparing Angle and Benoit) Even though Dru and Spike were minor characters after Angel turned, it was all about the building tension between the three of them. (The end of "I Only Have Eyes for You" when Spike gets OUT OF THE CHAIR is just AWESOME!) I actually think Spike, although he didn't do as much, was cooler back then. (Sure, he was a wheelchair bound most of the season, but I think the key to his coolness was less is more. In some respects, he would go on to be just a parody of what he used to be... not that I dislike his character) And of course, there's the two references to the Mayor setting up next season ("I Only Have Eyes for You" and "Becoming Part 2") Plus, there's the twist where the season starts with Willow crushing on Xander who loves someone else (Buffy), as Buffy returns, and the season ends with Xander admitting he loves Willow while she loves someone else (Oz), as Buffy exits. I also noticed that they practically fit the basic plot of Season 5 (Dawn's blood is the key to a hell dimension the big bad (Glory) is trying to open and someone (Angel) must be sacrificed to shut it) into "Becoming Part 2" (Angel's blood is the key to the hell dimension the big bad (Angelus) is trying to open and someone (Buffy) must be sacrificed to shut it). And also they established the pattern for Tara's death (Tara and Willow fight and break up, Tara and Willow reconcile and get back together, Tara dies) with Jenny Calendar's death (Giles and Jenny fight and break up, Giles and Jenny reconcile, and just as they are going to get back together, Jenny dies). AND there's the forewarning about Willow dabbling in the black arts that leads to season 6.

If anything, the show was better back then because it had a clear focus: to showcase the horror genre with a twist on it, and compare it to the experiences of high school. Pretty much everything they set up in the first two seasons gets blown off at the end of Season 3, and its back to the drawing board to start anew for Season 4. Spike replaces Angel, Anya replaces Cordelia, Tara replaces Oz, and everything starts building to the last few episodes of season 6. (Even Dawn is introduced in season 4, as at the beginning of the Faith two-parter, Faith dreams of Buffy making the bed saying she has to prepare for her little sister). The problem though is that once Buffy left college, there was no grounding for the show. It stopped being a show about a girl living in two worlds, and as a result, part of the fun, of contrasting reality with the supernatural, was lost. The show was still good, but something was missing. And even though they tried to send Buffy back to school this season, they can't get it back. Part of the problem is that you can only do it once. In season 2, Buffy faced Sunnydale's versions of a Werewolf, Frankenstein, and the Mummy. You can't go back and do that again. In some ways, they've tried redoing classic plots, such as with the Invisibility episodes (seasons 1 and 6). The show lost its ability to present a demon/monster, have the scoobies attempt to figure out what was up with said monster, and then have someone in danger while the group tries to figure out how to defeat it. Now, episodes have started with Buffy fighting some random demon at the beginning. The group got too powerful (which is why they had to start fighting amonst themselves.

Sorry this post is so long. I'm just saying that I liked the show ALOT during seasons 2-3, and now I only like it alot. Still, I'm hoping that once its over, I'll be able to look back at season 7 and see foreshadowing and subtleties I missed and I'll realize just how awesome this season was.
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#9 Posted on 27.2.03 1302.26
Reposted on: 27.2.10 1310.57
I will agree something was lost when Buffy went to college, but I think that has to do with the change factor that any good show has. We were all accustomed to the surroundings of the High School that like in real life. The College Years or just those years in general in one's life does lead to less foundation and more of an exploration of who you are really are. I enjoyed Season 4 mainly due to the fact I was in college at the time and found some of the things the cast encountered to be similar to what I found as well. The opening shot of the college library and Buffy's reaction was on par with mine as I saw my college library. I relate to Season 4 in those steps the cast takes in that lifestyle, Granted there was no government base underneath us, then again...

I really don't like Season 5 that much and found it to be the worst season out of the bunch. If I had to my way, I'd have killed Dawn and Glory and hit the reset button. However, the plots for this season and the last one would not have occured, so I see why season 5 has to happen. I do think this has been their best season to do with so much of it wrapped in one mystery after another and has allowed the fans to start talking about it more than any other season. There has been a ton of forshadowing, little clues dropped that make me start to see how this is going to end. I do think the characters have grown way too powerful and I enjoy it. If these characters weren't as powerful besides Xander, then they probably wouldn't have lasted this long. You have to remember that the more battles a person has, the better fighter they become. It makes sense that a random Vamp won;'t take them out, because most of the cast has killed a vampire or other demon. It makes totally sense to me.

A Fan- Season show the natural order of a life, Buffy couldn't be stuck in that same school forever.

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#10 Posted on 27.2.03 1644.06
Reposted on: 27.2.10 1644.18
I feel about Buffy the way I feel about Sabrina the Teenaged Witch. When they were in school, it was pretty cool, but with 'grown up' Buffy and Sabrina, what's the point, where are the childish hijinx we are used to?

However, they are both cuter then buttons so I still record or watch if I'm home... yes I AM a sad human being.

(wc-64)
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#11 Posted on 27.2.03 1810.55
Reposted on: 27.2.10 1814.38
A few ennumerated points, because, for whatever reason, that is how I write now:

1) Buffy in the early seasons (especially 1 and 2) suffered from a case of "Monster-of-the-Weekitis", where the plot was kept fresh by introducing a new monster every week. The big problems with this were eventually you'll run out of monsters, and besides, you're showing the gang dealing deftly with all of them, so eventually, you're going to lose interest. A wrestling analogy: If Brock Lesner is your WWE Champion and he goes over a heel clean every Smackdown, you're going to run out of heel competetors, and besides, nobody is going to believe that anybody can beat the face.

2) One thing the first season did well at was killing Buffy off, only to have her make a comeback. It showed that, while the hero IS still weak, she can fight back and overcome adversity, which is just the kind of person that people want to cheer for. However, while the Master was built up well as a credible threat, he wasn't really a threat every episode, which took alot of the serial elements out of it (though many remained in tact, surprising for the first season of a show).

3) The second season was much better about keeping the serial aspect, but they didn't catch on until what was probably too late in the season. Angelous was the perfect villain (especially because so much of the show was spent getting people emotionally invested in the Angel/Buffy Romance. However, for such a serious subject matter, alot of the first half of the season was spent making cheesy attempts at "Teen Horror" (Go Fish being a prime example).

4) Season Three did a wonderful job of setting itself up as one of the best shows on TV. They introduced a character which people immediately cared about (the conflicted slayer) and an amazing villain (the too wholesome to be good so he's evil Mayor), and they stuck with that as the plot all season. Almost everything they did built to the final battle, even the subplot villians (like Balthazaar) had ties to the main story. Then again of course, two of the best episodes (The Wish and Dopplegangland) had nothing to do with the main plot.

5) Season Four suffered from a completely different set of problems. First, because Buffy and Willow (and Oz...sort of) were in college they had to really stretch to bring the other characters into the stories, especially Giles (whose entire story for a good part of Seasons 4-6 was that he was feeling left out of the stories). So all the time spent developing characters like Xander and Giles was wasted on new characters that weren't quite as interesting (i.e. Riley). Add to that that the "Secret Government Agency" plot wasn't all that thrilling or original, and the fact that the main villain of the season didn't show up until nobody cared anymore (and seemed more like the main villain's crazy bodyguard than a villian himself) , and you've got a lackluster season with only one real standout episode (the INCREDIBLE Hush, and I would add Superstar, but I don't know if anyone else would).

6) Season Five...I actually liked it. It started with a shock (Buffy's mysterious sister), and developed that mystery over the entire season, ending with the battle with the villain and Dawn tied in. Yeah, Dawn is whiny, yeah she wasn't developed very well, and Glory may not have been the best villian, but the Season itself, I thought was extremely well drawn out.

7) Season Six the "Where do we go from here?" season. The characters and episodes were extremely thinly (and poorly IMHO) written and only one episode was really great (Once More with Feeling), and things were so contrary to the natural order that the plotlines advanced in the season were really drawn out. But I think the high point was the fact that the writers admitted they really didn't know what to do from there (she's already beaten a god...now what?).

8) So far, Season Seven has been tremendous. They've got a villain, they've got a plot and you get the feeling that everything is leading somewhere. The characters are all well written and well intertwined again, and everything is making sense.

I'm sad to see it go, yeah. It's probably for the best, but after making these characters part of my daily routine for several years now, and debating every little ioda of almost every episode, it's pretty sad to see it all come to a close.
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#12 Posted on 27.2.03 2014.37
Reposted on: 27.2.10 2018.32
I have to side with the people who favor seasons 1-3 over everything since. Don't get me wrong, it's all still quality, but for me, the problems with those seasons are pretty glaring.

The problem with season 4 was the main villian. Adam is about as interesting as navel lint. Season 4 has a bunch of really good episodes ('A New Man," "Hush," "Something Blue") what hurts it is that for all those good episodes, I didn't actually care about the main plot.

Season 5 wasn't too bad...it just ended wrong. Let Dawn make the sacrifice, and let Buffy be broken because of it.

Season 6 -- I understand the writers wanted to take it to an adult level, and make things a bit darker, but in that season, dark mostly meant an entire season of the characters moping around or generally making a mess of their lives. It became hard for me to believe these people were friends anymore -- one of the core points that drives the show (By far, the biggest problem was the lack of Giles, though it couldn't be helped -- his presence as the 'adult' of the gang is an understated, yet valuable part of the group dynamic). The Dark willow storyline, with the magic-as-drug motif? Lame. They switched it from Willow using magic to shape events to her liking (while believing that she's helping others), to a poorly executed "I'm addicted to magic!" storyline. Compare Dark Magic Willow vs VampWillow in terms of who you can believe is more evil. It's not even close.

Season seven, while it has had its moments ("Conversations With Dead People," for example, is QUALITY), still seems lacking. You have episodes ripping off better versions from previous seasons ("Him"), episodes that drag on and seem to be unecessarily stretched out ("Bring on The Night," "Showtime," and "Potential" could have been condensed into 2 episodes -- the first two are practically the SAME episode), and some baffling behavior by the characters (It takes forever for the gang to realize that no one has touched Giles. Or why any of them wouldn't touch him at some point? And I know they're part of the storyline, but if all the slayers-in-training ended up dead at the end, it'd be fine by me).

Compare that to events over on Angel, where Wolfram & Hart's been destroyed, the Sun is blacked out, the city is flaming and under siege by demons, and Angelus is back. All this in less episodes. IMHO, ANgel has been a much better show than Buffy this season. That being said, I will be sad to see it go, mainly for the fact that with the networks' growing obsession with reality TV and not giving decent new shows have a chance to stick around most of the time, there may not be too many shows with that quality on again any time soon.

(edited by shockdown on 27.2.03 1816)
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#13 Posted on 27.2.03 2218.59
Reposted on: 27.2.10 2219.16
I thought the writers did a great job with Season 6. I felt the episodes were written on a level that the past seasons couldn't get to. To me, seaosn 6 was one about growing up and getting lost in the world. Granted, there was no major villian minus Dark Willow and I thought that was fine. The Trio did get annoying at the end, but it did lead to Tara's death and Willow's heel turn. I just thought the pinicale of that season was about lose and trying to regain it or at least of sense of humanity. If you watch the end of the season, you see Willow loses Tara, Xander and Anya lose each other, Buffy has lost a part of herself, Giles and Dawn feel lost in the group, Spike losses his bad ass ways. In the end, Buffy finds herself through her love for Dawn, Willow overcomes her loss for Tara thanks to Xander and Gile's spell and Spike gets his soul back. The season was worth it just to see how everything came together.

Angel has been great this season, but that is mainly due the fact that Joss is going to weave both shows together. I wouldn't even bother watching Angel if I didn't hear about the potential crossover. Angel has been awesome, but I don't see the major ramifications that Buffy has had. Where the hell is the Intitative when LA went dark? I can suspend my disbelief for awhile, but when you have a built in plot device like those guys its hard not to use it.

A Fan- Waiting for Season 4 on DVD.
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#14 Posted on 27.2.03 2354.13
Reposted on: 27.2.10 2356.56
I'm more surprised that the Scoobies haven't caught the news about LA experiencing a black out yet. Although given that the Initiative is a Buffy plot device, what's to say that they aren't running around LA, and just not running into Connor and the gang? (and thus, there's no good reason to highlight them on Angel)

And I'm not saying that the show should never have changed and left them in high school (I think trying to send the gang back to high school this semester was a misguided attempt at recreating the past), but rather that I enjoyed the high school eps better. That said, I agree that the way season 6 came together at the end was awesome. I think we should be glad that we had a show on for seven seasons where even at its worst it was still damn good tv.

Change may be necessary, but it doesn't mean I have to like it.

(edited by EddieBurkett on 28.2.03 0055)
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#15 Posted on 28.2.03 0442.25
Reposted on: 28.2.10 0447.02
This season has been garbage, as far as I'm concerned. None of the episodes has stood on anything approaching the level of even their fair-to-middling stuff, and the "slayerettes" are completely depthless caricatures ("Hi, I'm the Gay Slayerette." "Hi, I'm the Weird Slayerette." "Hi, I'm the Token Black Slayerette.") who so far only seem to exist to die now and then and provide Buffy with an excuse to turn into Hard-Ass General Buffy Patton.

They've got millions of different directions they could be going, directions that could actually lead into something worthwhile for a spinoff (exploring Willow's new conflicts with her powers, Spike trying to come to grips with getting himself be-souled again, not to mention his connection with Principal Version 2 and being slightly bonkers, etcetera, etcetera) and they're all but ignoring ANYTHING resembling character development, giving it the barest of lip service so they can do yet ANOTHER apocalypse storyline, with even MORE impossible odds. After Glory, they REALLY ought to have just backed away from "end of the world" shit... someone's got a hardon for the End Times on their staff, I swear. Last season didn't need Armageddon to make the end worth watching, yet they tacked it on anyway.
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#16 Posted on 28.2.03 0542.05
Reposted on: 28.2.10 0549.21
Two things:

First, I think the reason they aren't exploring possible future spinoffs is that they're not sure that there will be any.

Second, I think they are doing a wonderful job of character developement this season (outside the Slayerettes), but it's the "end-of" character developement.

Of the main characters:

Buffy: Finally coming to grips with what her calling as "The Slayer" means, and coming face to face with what she was when the series began. I think she's being such a hardass because she knows that there won't be anyone who cares enough to take up the slack for these girls.

Spike: Trying to find his place in the group. He still isn't sure he wants one, but he knows he wants Buffy. The soul is making it easier, but in many ways it's also making it harder, to "fit in".

Willow: Finally come to terms with life with magic. In alot of ways, she's finally come to terms with who she was in Season 2-4, the "second banana" of the group whose powers can't and shouldn't overshadow the group.

Xander: He's always slid into the role of the "everyman", but I think his speach to Dawn showed that he finally understands the lessons that "The Zeppo" taught him. The grunt work is just as important as any other work, it's just less glorified.

Anya: An interesting case. She's still searching for "Who she is". Two weeks ago, Buffy asked her what she was doing there and she didn't have a ready explaination. She's always defined herself by her associations (Olaf, D'Hoffryn, Xander, even Spike in an odd way), but now she has none to really speak of. The man who gave her purpose (D'Hoffryn) is trying to kill her and the man who loved her (Xander) isn't sure he still does. Now that she's well and convinced that the world will end, she's trying to find purpose (see her time with Xander last week).

Dawn: Really finally figuring out what being an adult and being responsible means. Coming to realize that the world is a bigger place, and now she's just a really small part of that.

Giles: He got his "smile" back. He's got purpose and maybe some moxy, though he's not really on the show enough to show it.

Minor Characters:

Principle Wood: Though he's only been here one season, he's already complex enough to be at a character crossroad. He knows he falls on the side of "good" and what that entails, but it is difficult to put aside his feelings about Spike and do what is right for the world.

Andrew: Realizing now that there is a difference between evil and Evil.

Maybe I'm overanalizing it too much, but I think that this season is being built to end the show, and the reason that there is lack of character "developement" is that the characters are finally saying, "Hey, this is who I am, and I accept that". Which begs the question, "Is that enough?"

Here I'm going to get REALLY stylistic: Yeah, the Slayerettes without names are cannon fodder, but they're really just a plot device but I think they all represent parts of Buffy that are finally meshing. Kennedy is the Season 1-4 Buffy that was capable of being in control of her powers and her allys, but easily distracted by her feelings and a bit of Season 5 too, a bit too confident in her abilities. Amanda is Season 1-2 Buffy who is sweet and chipper and innocent, and doesn't really know what the hell she's gotten herself into. The Black Slayerette (don't recall her name) is Season 6 Buffy, cynical and snarky and really really in need of either a good kick in the shins or a hug. The Redhead (again, name?) is Season 1-2 Buffy, stylized (take off the damned BEANIE ALREADY) and smart, but easily cannon fodder. And of course, dear departed Chloe, Seasons 1-7, the Buffy that, in the face of danger, isn't sure that she can defeat it. Again, maybe I'm off base with these characterizations, but I think that Buffy sees alot of herself in these girls, and is starting to realize what alot of her own faults have been, and why these girls alone won't be enough.

See? Overanalysis doesn't have to make EVERYTHING bad, it can make things FUN too!
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#17 Posted on 28.2.03 0926.36
Reposted on: 28.2.10 0929.05
I tend to agree with you Excalibur. I think all this "spin-off" talk is fan-boy wishful thinking. There are rumors all over the place, but nothing that's actually substantial. This has all the looks of a story that is coming to a close (and that's why it wouldn't make much sense to develop the SIT's characters. They're not going to around long enough for it to be worth while. I think they're only a plot device to put over that this will be the biggest battle ever, the battle to end all battles, and they need all the help they can get. Their only other purpose is to be killed.)

That's not to say that JW won't pitch a show next season somewhat related to the Buffy universe. But if I were guessing, it will have brand new characters, and pretty much be a whole different show.

I agree, Nate, that the apocalypse thing has been WAY overused. It shold have been saved for the last season (maybe they didn't save it because of uncertainty, in TV-land sometimes you don't exactly get a lot of advance warning about when the last season may be!). But what's done is done. But since they have done that over and over, this battle should be the end of them all. The end should result of the end for the need for slayers, at least at Sunnydale. Something has to differentiate this season from others as a true end, true closure.
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#18 Posted on 28.2.03 1334.30
Reposted on: 28.2.10 1334.52
Now, Eliza is off doing another show, I don't forsee a new ideas for spin-offs. I have accepted the end of both Buffy and Angel. The only way, I see it working is after the huge battle those who survive go to Angel and the Hellmouth is destroyed. There is a ton of prophecies that need to happen first that will occur if this is the final battle. 1. Buffy leads the army of light at Armaggedon (1st Season) 2. Angel gets his soul back after that (Angel Season 1) 3. Buffy will be the last guardian of the hellmouth (Season 7). I could see them prolonging the Angel thing for a bit since he turned to Angelus, but by looking at the prophecies you can see where Joss has been going with this.

I liked last year's apoclypse angle, because Xander got to save the world which more than made up for that overused plot device. Only season 3 and 4 didn't have the end of the world plot device for the finales. Sure, the Mayor turned into a snake, but its not like it was going to end the world just destroy Sunnydale and the kids. In 4, Adam was only creating an army to fight the military either, its not the end of the world. In both of those seasons, Buffy's team didn;t have to stop them, they could have ran and let the government come in and naplam the Mayor and the govt, probably would have nuked a city to get to Adam anyway. It is an overused plot device, but some reason this season they have done a great job of getting the feel that this is The End.

A Fan- I also agree there is no more room for character development nor should there be. Its been seven years, if these guys don't know who they are then its due to poor writing.

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#19 Posted on 28.2.03 1758.55
Reposted on: 28.2.10 1759.07

The new Entertainment Weekly has SMG on the cover with a "BUFFY QUITS" headline.

I've not read it yet (just got it like 10 minutes ago) but the cover promises much Buffitude in this issue.

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#20 Posted on 28.2.03 1956.32
Reposted on: 28.2.10 1959.01
Perhaps a spinoff ISN'T so far off the then we think. This is taken from The Hollywood Reporter...

UPN is set to do a "Willow" series for the 2004 TV season. Alyson Hannigan is apparently attached to play the character again and the pilot is set to begin shooting in the fall. Joss Whedon is attached only executive producer.

...that last line has me a bit worried though.
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