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The 7 - Baseball - Congrats to Sutter Register and log in to post!
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too-old-now
Bockwurst
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#1 Posted on 10.1.06 1338.01
Reposted on: 10.1.13 1338.41
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/baseball/mlb/01/10/hof.2006.ap/index.html

I'm slightly disappointed in Rice not making it, but I gotta feel that his relationship with the media while he was a player had something to do with him not getting in.

Promote this thread!
Wpob
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#2 Posted on 10.1.06 1423.59
Reposted on: 10.1.13 1424.29
By the looks of the voting and seeing that Sutter got in by the skin of his teeth (10 votes), I see no one else making the HoF in future years. This was Rice's best and last shot. Same for Gossage. Too many first time balloters coming down the pike.
BigSteve
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#3 Posted on 10.1.06 1439.35
Reposted on: 10.1.13 1439.39
What made Sutter a better candidate now then he was in the first twelve times on the ballot other than the fact that he was the best guy there this time around? I'd like to see them cut the number of times on the ballot from fifteen to five at the most.

As for whether he deserved it or not, I'd say no. He had 8 great years and four below average years. I don't think that a starter would get in with eight great seasons, and I don't feel a guy who pitched half as many innings deserves it. On the other hand, he was a good pitcher, and it isn't an embarassing selection by any stretch so it's pretty cool that the guy gets the honor.
StaggerLee
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#4 Posted on 10.1.06 1932.55
Reposted on: 10.1.13 1933.26
    Originally posted by BigSteve
    As for whether he deserved it or not, I'd say no. He had 8 great years and four below average years. I don't think that a starter would get in with eight great seasons, and I don't feel a guy who pitched half as many innings deserves it. On the other hand, he was a good pitcher, and it isn't an embarassing selection by any stretch so it's pretty cool that the guy gets the honor.


http://www.baseball-reference.com/k/koufasa01.shtml

Sandy Koufax has only 8 above .500 seasson out of 12 and HE is in the HOF. Please tell me you dont think Sandy is undeserving.
AWArulz
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#5 Posted on 10.1.06 2037.35
Reposted on: 10.1.13 2038.08
And I want to point out this insightful post.

http://the-w.com/thread.php/id=28145&page=#318436


Man, this guy is good

BigSteve
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#6 Posted on 10.1.06 2202.42
Reposted on: 10.1.13 2203.20
    Originally posted by StaggerLee
      Originally posted by BigSteve
      As for whether he deserved it or not, I'd say no. He had 8 great years and four below average years. I don't think that a starter would get in with eight great seasons, and I don't feel a guy who pitched half as many innings deserves it. On the other hand, he was a good pitcher, and it isn't an embarassing selection by any stretch so it's pretty cool that the guy gets the honor.


    http://www.baseball-reference.com/k/koufasa01.shtml

    Sandy Koufax has only 8 above .500 seasson out of 12 and HE is in the HOF. Please tell me you dont think Sandy is undeserving.


Different circumstances since Koufax had to retire in his prime due to injury. His last season was his best so without the elbow injury he could have put up ridiculous career numbers. Plus Koufax was pitching 330 innings at the end of his career while Sutter only threw 120 in his best season.
StaggerLee
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#7 Posted on 11.1.06 1645.22
Reposted on: 11.1.13 1645.33
Well, Sutter was a relief pitcher, so of course he would have a third the innings as Koufax.

As for his "down" years, when your team only hits .500 ONCE, its hard to get a lot of saves.

Eddie Famous
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#8 Posted on 11.1.06 1738.48
Reposted on: 11.1.13 1739.32
Sutter was the first pitcher to be used exclusively in save situations. And he was the best of his time.
too-old-now
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#9 Posted on 12.1.06 1043.32
Reposted on: 12.1.13 1043.45
I heard that he's the ONLY member of the Hall of Fame who never appeared in a starting lineup. I think they forgot about announcers, broadcasters, and of course Abbott and Costello.

TheOldMan
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#10 Posted on 12.1.06 1922.39
Reposted on: 12.1.13 1923.23
Not to mention Eddie Gaedel and the Brooklyn Sym-phony.

Second the congrats here - as a Cub fan, the first time I saw Bruce strike out the side was like watching the moon landing. Not that I generally try and remember 1969.
wmatistic
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#11 Posted on 13.1.06 0850.44
Reposted on: 13.1.13 0850.54
    Originally posted by BigSteve
      Originally posted by StaggerLee
        Originally posted by BigSteve
        As for whether he deserved it or not, I'd say no. He had 8 great years and four below average years. I don't think that a starter would get in with eight great seasons, and I don't feel a guy who pitched half as many innings deserves it. On the other hand, he was a good pitcher, and it isn't an embarassing selection by any stretch so it's pretty cool that the guy gets the honor.


      http://www.baseball-reference.com/k/koufasa01.shtml

      Sandy Koufax has only 8 above .500 seasson out of 12 and HE is in the HOF. Please tell me you dont think Sandy is undeserving.


    Different circumstances since Koufax had to retire in his prime due to injury. His last season was his best so without the elbow injury he could have put up ridiculous career numbers. Plus Koufax was pitching 330 innings at the end of his career while Sutter only threw 120 in his best season.


Yes, but we don't go on what a guy "could" have done had he not gotten injured. That's just speculation, and whether or not it would have come true is not a reason that should be used in the hall of fame debate. You have to compare Sutter to other closers, and in that regard he was worthy of this election I think.

Interesting point on ESPN radio this week regarding Pete Rose now being out of eligibility. How can a guy be run out of something he was never given?

(edited by wmatistic on 13.1.06 0652)
Sec19Row53
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#12 Posted on 13.1.06 0931.55
Reposted on: 13.1.13 0932.13
    Originally posted by wmatistic
    Interesting point on ESPN radio this week regarding Pete Rose now being out of eligibility. How can a guy be run out of something he was never given?

I think the logic is that you can only be elected by the BBWAA after you've been retired for 5 years, and within 20 years of being retired. Once that time frame is past, you can only be elected by the Veteran's Committee. Since only "eligible" people can be elected, it's not that's he's run out of eligibility (as Pete has portrayed), it's that he's run out of time.

It's all semantics.
Big Bad
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#13 Posted on 14.1.06 0141.40
Reposted on: 14.1.13 0142.30
Sutter, to me, is one of those guys who would easily make a Hall of The Outstanding, but not the Hall of Fame. In fact, there are about 20 guys I could cut from the current Hall to make it more elite. Next year will have the slam dunks of Ripken and Gwynn, but I wonder what the voters will do with Big Mac, given the steroid scandal? I think he still makes it in, but by the skin of his teeth.
AWArulz
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#14 Posted on 14.1.06 1412.01
Reposted on: 14.1.13 1412.03
    Originally posted by Big Bad
    .... but I wonder what the voters will do with Big Mac, given the steroid scandal? I think he still makes it in, but by the skin of his teeth.


Perhaps. I don't think Maris is in, is he? But Mac has plus 500 HRs, which is an automatic ticket, I think. He was out before the scandal struck and anything he used was probably legal at the time.
wmatistic
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#15 Posted on 16.1.06 0835.38
Reposted on: 16.1.13 0836.07
    Originally posted by AWArulz
      Originally posted by Big Bad
      .... but I wonder what the voters will do with Big Mac, given the steroid scandal? I think he still makes it in, but by the skin of his teeth.


    Perhaps. I don't think Maris is in, is he? But Mac has plus 500 HRs, which is an automatic ticket, I think. He was out before the scandal struck and anything he used was probably legal at the time.


Some of what he used was legal at the time, but I do believe he was doing the illegal stuff too. Which is a shame because I'm a huge Cards fan, but it is what it is. Seems like a whole ton of players were doing that stuff in the end, and he outperformed them. Above all though, no one has any evidence that proves he did it, so they can't really use speculation as a reason to keep him out. At least they shouldn't.
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