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wmatistic
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Since: 2.2.04
From: Austin, TX

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#21 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.08
    Originally posted by Leroy
    They just announced that he broke the record.


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Joseph Ryder
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Since: 19.3.02
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#22 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.37




My next marathon is October 7th 2007 -- Royal Victoria
The Guinness.
Morcilla








Since: 24.4.05
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#23 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.21
I purposely avoided baseball since 755 (Padres fan had to watch). I didn't want to see it. I found out here on this very site.

I tried posting something witty a few times since 756 happened. I gave up. I'll stick with my Congratulations* from earlier. For the most part I feel like.....well whatever.


Bonds probably won't be the only guy with an asterisk next to his name in the HoF. However, I really hope I see his record broken (without an asterisk) in my life time!

It is what it is. I shouldn't have to feel that way about such a prestigious record but again, it is what it is.



"In Soviet Russia, site fucks you." - drjayphd

It's False
Scrapple








Since: 20.6.02
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#24 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.64
Despite what all of us might think of Bonds, I think it was incredibly classy of Hank Aaron to make his presence felt after the record was broken. Even Bonds acknowledged that it was unrealistic to expect a man Aaron's age to travel so much, but he did the best thing he could have done by taping a heartfelt speech.

On the other end of the spectrum, Bud Selig made a jackass out of himself again.


    "I congratulate Barry Bonds for establishing a new, career home run record. Barry's achievement is noteworthy and remarkable," Selig said in a statement. "While the issues which have swirled around this record will continue to work themselves toward resolution, today is a day for congratulations on a truly remarkable achievement."


Everyone decided to put personal feelings aside and give Bonds his day. Bud Selig was the only one to go "Hey congratulations, but you're still in the middle of a steroids investigation! STEROIDS STEROIDS STEROIDS!" I realize Bonds is probably (well, more than likely) on the stuff, but for the love of God, give the guy his moment for one freakin' night. Shut the hell up about steroids for one night and show an ounce of class! THIS is the Commissioner of Major League Baseball!

(edited by It's False on 8.8.07 0337)



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wmatistic
Andouille








Since: 2.2.04
From: Austin, TX

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#25 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.08
    Originally posted by It's False
    Despite what all of us might think of Bonds, I think it was incredibly classy of Hank Aaron to make his presence felt after the record was broken. Even Bonds acknowledged that it was unrealistic to expect a man Aaron's age to travel so much, but he did the best thing he could have done by taping a heartfelt speech.

    On the other end of the spectrum, Bud Selig made a jackass out of himself again.


      "I congratulate Barry Bonds for establishing a new, career home run record. Barry's achievement is noteworthy and remarkable," Selig said in a statement. "While the issues which have swirled around this record will continue to work themselves toward resolution, today is a day for congratulations on a truly remarkable achievement."


    Everyone decided to put personal feelings aside and give Bonds his day. Bud Selig was the only one to go "Hey congratulations, but you're still in the middle of a steroids investigation! STEROIDS STEROIDS STEROIDS!" I realize Bonds is probably (well, more than likely) on the stuff, but for the love of God, give the guy his moment for one freakin' night. Shut the hell up about steroids for one night and show an ounce of class! THIS is the Commissioner of Major League Baseball!

    (edited by It's False on 8.8.07 0337)


Why exactly should the commisioner give a known cheater "his moment"? Sorry, but in my view anytime this "moment" is mentioned I want it attached to steroids. The commisioner was correct to remind everyone of that in my view.
cfgb
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Ottawa, Ontario

Since last post: 47 min.
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#26 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.50
    Originally posted by wmatistic
      Originally posted by It's False
      Despite what all of us might think of Bonds, I think it was incredibly classy of Hank Aaron to make his presence felt after the record was broken. Even Bonds acknowledged that it was unrealistic to expect a man Aaron's age to travel so much, but he did the best thing he could have done by taping a heartfelt speech.

      On the other end of the spectrum, Bud Selig made a jackass out of himself again.


        "I congratulate Barry Bonds for establishing a new, career home run record. Barry's achievement is noteworthy and remarkable," Selig said in a statement. "While the issues which have swirled around this record will continue to work themselves toward resolution, today is a day for congratulations on a truly remarkable achievement."


      Everyone decided to put personal feelings aside and give Bonds his day. Bud Selig was the only one to go "Hey congratulations, but you're still in the middle of a steroids investigation! STEROIDS STEROIDS STEROIDS!" I realize Bonds is probably (well, more than likely) on the stuff, but for the love of God, give the guy his moment for one freakin' night. Shut the hell up about steroids for one night and show an ounce of class! THIS is the Commissioner of Major League Baseball!

      (edited by It's False on 8.8.07 0337)


    Why exactly should the commisioner give a known cheater "his moment"? Sorry, but in my view anytime this "moment" is mentioned I want it attached to steroids. The commisioner was correct to remind everyone of that in my view.




No, it's NOT the commissioners spot to be speculating publically. He should be the most tight-lipped person in the sport concerning who's currently being investigated, but he can't keep his trap shut about Bonds for a minute.

It's classless, and lacks any kind of tact on his part. What if Bonds has been telling the truth the whole time? Despite what we may think, and the overwhelming evidence to support it - there is still the off-chance that he is an innocent man.

All Selig is doing by continually bringing up the roids is bringing a heavier cloud of rain over a sport that's already got enough problems. As the commissioner, he should be embracing the moment as it's come now.

What happened last night would be akin to Vince walking out on RAW after the Benoit tragedy and announcing "Chris Benoit killed his family and himself, so you'll never hear his name again" PRIOR to receiving the facts. As they were unsure, they ran a classy tribute show.

And it's exactly what Selig should have done last night until he has the facts. Do your job as commissioner, congratulate the feat itself, and keep your opinion to yourself.
wmatistic
Andouille








Since: 2.2.04
From: Austin, TX

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#27 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.08
    Originally posted by cfgb
      Originally posted by wmatistic
        Originally posted by It's False
        Despite what all of us might think of Bonds, I think it was incredibly classy of Hank Aaron to make his presence felt after the record was broken. Even Bonds acknowledged that it was unrealistic to expect a man Aaron's age to travel so much, but he did the best thing he could have done by taping a heartfelt speech.

        On the other end of the spectrum, Bud Selig made a jackass out of himself again.


          "I congratulate Barry Bonds for establishing a new, career home run record. Barry's achievement is noteworthy and remarkable," Selig said in a statement. "While the issues which have swirled around this record will continue to work themselves toward resolution, today is a day for congratulations on a truly remarkable achievement."


        Everyone decided to put personal feelings aside and give Bonds his day. Bud Selig was the only one to go "Hey congratulations, but you're still in the middle of a steroids investigation! STEROIDS STEROIDS STEROIDS!" I realize Bonds is probably (well, more than likely) on the stuff, but for the love of God, give the guy his moment for one freakin' night. Shut the hell up about steroids for one night and show an ounce of class! THIS is the Commissioner of Major League Baseball!

        (edited by It's False on 8.8.07 0337)


      Why exactly should the commisioner give a known cheater "his moment"? Sorry, but in my view anytime this "moment" is mentioned I want it attached to steroids. The commisioner was correct to remind everyone of that in my view.




    No, it's NOT the commissioners spot to be speculating publically. He should be the most tight-lipped person in the sport concerning who's currently being investigated, but he can't keep his trap shut about Bonds for a minute.

    It's classless, and lacks any kind of tact on his part. What if Bonds has been telling the truth the whole time? Despite what we may think, and the overwhelming evidence to support it - there is still the off-chance that he is an innocent man.

    All Selig is doing by continually bringing up the roids is bringing a heavier cloud of rain over a sport that's already got enough problems. As the commissioner, he should be embracing the moment as it's come now.

    What happened last night would be akin to Vince walking out on RAW after the Benoit tragedy and announcing "Chris Benoit killed his family and himself, so you'll never hear his name again" PRIOR to receiving the facts. As they were unsure, they ran a classy tribute show.

    And it's exactly what Selig should have done last night until he has the facts. Do your job as commissioner, congratulate the feat itself, and keep your opinion to yourself.


Barry Bonds admitted to taking steroids. What facts exactly are you waiting for? That after beginning the Balco program and all of a sudden getting stronger and better than he's ever been at an age when no one else does that he really believed he was just using flakseed oil? That's what you're waiting for?

And even if by some ridiculous idiocy on Barry's part it was the case that he didn't know what he was taking, does it change the fact that his performance was affected by steroids?

(edited by wmatistic on 8.8.07 0623)
cfgb
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Ottawa, Ontario

Since last post: 47 min.
Last activity: 27 min.
#28 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.50
    Originally posted by wmatistic


    Barry Bonds admitted to taking steroids. What facts exactly are you waiting for? That after beginning the Balco program and all of a sudden getting stronger and better than he's ever been at an age when no one else does that he really believed he was just using flakseed oil? That's what you're waiting for?

    And even if by some ridiculous idiocy on Barry's part it was the case that he didn't know what he was taking, does it change the fact that his performance was affected by steroids?

    (edited by wmatistic on 8.8.07 0623)


I'm well aware of the leaked congressional testimony, so you don't need to educate me. I've read Game Of Shadows and have followed the case.

But since he hasn't been convicted of a crime, Bud does not have the right to hold that over Barry. I realize he's not in love with the idea of Bonds holding the record, but at the risk of repeating myself - LAST NIGHT WAS NOT THE TIME AND PLACE. The record was broken, there is NOTHING that can be done until there is evidence that Bonds knowingly took steroids, end of story.

We live on a continent that allows us to be treated as innocent until proven guilty. When Kobe won an NBA title while the alleged rape case was taking place, David Stern did not present him with the title and say "Kobe, this three-peat is quite the achievement for you and this Lakers team, despite the controversy surrounding you at this time." And it's not his place to do so. That's up to the courts.

Bud Selig is not the law. He is supposed to be the impartial face of baseball.
The Goon
Boudin blanc
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Since: 2.1.02
From: Calgary, Alberta, Canada

Since last post: 27 days
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#29 Posted on | Instant Rating: 8.25
I caught the highlights this morning - a great night for baseball all around, from Bonds himself in his words afterwards, the joyous reaction of the fans, the pitcher (Mike Bacsik) who tipped his cap to Bonds as Barry was rounding the bases, to the appearance of Hank Aaron on the screen.

It wasn't just that Aaron appeared - I really appreciated what he said as well, putting this achievement in its historic context. I look forward to the day when Bonds' eventual total is broken, and he does something similar.

As far as that eventual total, my guess is that with the pressure now off, he will have a better pace of hitting home runs for the rest of the season. Is there any discussion of whether he might move to an AL team to finish his career as a Designated Hitter?
wmatistic
Andouille








Since: 2.2.04
From: Austin, TX

Since last post: 24 days
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#30 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.08
    Originally posted by cfgb
      Originally posted by wmatistic


      Barry Bonds admitted to taking steroids. What facts exactly are you waiting for? That after beginning the Balco program and all of a sudden getting stronger and better than he's ever been at an age when no one else does that he really believed he was just using flakseed oil? That's what you're waiting for?

      And even if by some ridiculous idiocy on Barry's part it was the case that he didn't know what he was taking, does it change the fact that his performance was affected by steroids?

      (edited by wmatistic on 8.8.07 0623)


    I'm well aware of the leaked congressional testimony, so you don't need to educate me. I've read Game Of Shadows and have followed the case.

    But since he hasn't been convicted of a crime, Bud does not have the right to hold that over Barry. I realize he's not in love with the idea of Bonds holding the record, but at the risk of repeating myself - LAST NIGHT WAS NOT THE TIME AND PLACE. The record was broken, there is NOTHING that can be done until there is evidence that Bonds knowingly took steroids, end of story.

    We live on a continent that allows us to be treated as innocent until proven guilty. When Kobe won an NBA title while the alleged rape case was taking place, David Stern did not present him with the title and say "Kobe, this three-peat is quite the achievement for you and this Lakers team, despite the controversy surrounding you at this time." And it's not his place to do so. That's up to the courts.

    Bud Selig is not the law. He is supposed to be the impartial face of baseball.


I'm not trying to educate you or anything like that, I'm just saying I don't get this "innocent until proven guilty" stuff when he admitted what he did.

Kobe was being investigated for something that had no impact on his ability to play basketball. Barry took steroids, which directly lead to him getting this record. They are not in any way the same.

It doesn't matter if he hasn't been convicted in a court of law of some crime. He took steroids. The commisioner is supposed to ignore an admission of cheating?

If someone commits murder in a jealous fit of rage, they use the defense at times that they "didn't know what they were doing". That's neat and all, but you still killed someone. Extreme example of course(it's required by Internet law), but the idea is the same. Even if he didn't know what he was taking, he used steroids. The commisioner is not trying to be "the law" he's trying to be the commisioner of baseball with a known cheater in his league.

(edited by wmatistic on 8.8.07 0728)
cfgb
Lap cheong








Since: 2.1.02
From: Ottawa, Ontario

Since last post: 47 min.
Last activity: 27 min.
#31 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.50
    Originally posted by The Goon
    I caught the highlights this morning - a great night for baseball all around, from Bonds himself in his words afterwards, the joyous reaction of the fans, the pitcher (Mike Bacsik) who tipped his cap to Bonds as Barry was rounding the bases, to the appearance of Hank Aaron on the screen.

    It wasn't just that Aaron appeared - I really appreciated what he said as well, putting this achievement in its historic context. I look forward to the day when Bonds' eventual total is broken, and he does something similar.

    As far as that eventual total, my guess is that with the pressure now off, he will have a better pace of hitting home runs for the rest of the season. Is there any discussion of whether he might move to an AL team to finish his career as a Designated Hitter?


Betcha weren't aware he's still among the leaders in HRs per at bats!

It's true. He's popping them about once every 12.5 at bats. Even Prince Fielder isn't hitting them at that pace. I believe that only A-Rod is hitting them more frequently (with RYAN BRAUN of all people not far behind!). However, with his days off and all the walks, it just doesn't seem that he's hitting them with the feverish pace he once did. (Which is true ... It isn't once every SIX at bats like 2001!)

I think any teams in need of some serious pop in their lineup in the AL that don't consider him to DH are doing themselves a disservice. The Angels really could have benefitted from his bat this season. So could Oakland.
JayJayDean
Scrapple








Since: 2.1.02
From: Seattle, WA

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Y!:
#32 Posted on | Instant Rating: 7.40
On my way in the guys on my local sports radio station they were debating how great Barry would have been if he wouldn't have taken steroids, so I started messing around with Bill James' Favorite Toy and it was pretty interesting.

If you start with the 1998 season (when McGwire and Sosa hit all those HRs and Barry's jealousy led him to start juicing), his career stats looked like this:

411 HR
1917 hits
445 SB

Favorite Toy puts him here at the end of the 2003 season

605 HR
2725 hits
610 SB

On the one hand, 194 HR seems like a lot for Barry, but Hank Aaron hit 192 in his age 34-38 seasons. The steals seem like they would be high, too, but if you figure he kept his physique and speed, it's reasonable to project that he wouldn't have lost too many steals. Rickey Henderson stole 66 bases at 39 and 37 at 41, so it seems like Bonds could have averaged 33 per season.

It also makes sense that he would have a lot more hits (he actually had 2595) becauswe he probably would have maintained his walk rate instead of geting walked like crazy.

If you put the 605/2725/610 numbers in, you end up with final career totals (only based on his playing 2.5 more seasons, or not through 2006) as:

695 HR
3119 hits
684 SB

It's probably not too big of a stretch (given that he would have likely dropped off in his age 39-41 seasons) to make those his totals through the end of 2006, which means in Favorite Toy-land he would have started this season needing 5 HR to get to 700, and 19 to get to 714, with VERY little chance of getting to 755. He also could have had an outside chance to be a 700/700 career guy, which surely no one else could do.

Damn, Barry Bonds was GOOD. (Pre-juice, of course.)



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Since: 20.6.02
From: I am the Tag Team Champions!

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#33 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.64
    Originally posted by cfgb
    I think any teams in need of some serious pop in their lineup in the AL that don't consider him to DH are doing themselves a disservice. The Angels really could have benefitted from his bat this season. So could Oakland.


It just wouldn't have looked right if Bonds broke the record with someone else after spending so many years with the Giants organization. This moment wouldn't have had the gravity it did if his home fans were in Oakland or Anaheim. Bonds HAD to break this record in San Francisco, if for no other reason, than to do it for the fans that stood by him through the years.

Of course, now that the home run chase is over and the only thing left for Bonds is a World Series title, all bets are off. Look for him to put on that Angels uniform NEXT season to try to finish his career on top and in his hometown.




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Joseph Ryder
Head cheese








Since: 19.3.02
From: Seattle, WA

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#34 Posted on | Instant Rating: 5.37
    Originally posted by cfgb
    Of course, now that the home run chase is over and the only thing left for Bonds is a World Series title, all bets are off.


3000 hits, 800 HRs

(edited by Joseph Ryder on 8.8.07 1356)


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Cerebus
Knackwurst








Since: 17.11.02

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#35 Posted on | Instant Rating: 1.48
If I were a pitcher, I'd have just walked his ass.

The best thing 'for the sport' Barry Bonds could have done, knowing he's cheated his way to this record, would have been to fucking retire when he hit his 754th HR and said something along the lines of "I know I can break this record, but I shouldn't because it wouldn't be fair to the other guys who DIDN'T juice up and it wouldn't be fair to Hank Aaron."

He doesn't need the money, there really isn't any reason for him to go and do this with the world knowing he cheated his way to the record. It's an empty victory and it just drags the sport down with his fat headed, juiced up self.

Bud Selig finally does the RIGHT thing in my book. After all this time not saying if he'll be there for the breaking of the record, he comes out and seemingly gives an honest opinion of how he feels about it, and I for one applaud him for it.

Fuck Bonds for dragging Baseball FURTHER in the mud.
Zeruel
Thirty Millionth Hit
Moderator








Since: 2.1.02
From: The Silver Spring in the Land of Mary.

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#36 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.05
    Originally posted by cfgb
    Betcha weren't aware he's still among the leaders in HRs per at bats!

    It's true. He's popping them about once every 12.5 at bats.


I grabbed his stats from ESPN.com and It's more like 1 per 13 ABs.

9774/756 = 12.929 at bats per home run

And, if I'm reading his stats right, he's averaging 16.5 plate appearances per home run.

12513/756 = 16.551

And he is averaging one home run every four games

2959/756 = 3.914


Sammy Sosa is is averaging a home run about one every 14.5 at bats.

8742/604 = 14.474

And he is averaging 16.2 plate appearances per home run.

9819/604 = 16.257

And he is averaging one home run every four games

2331/604 = 3.859

If Sosa can keep his average up and Bonds starts trailing off, I think Sosa could pass Bonds in about five to six years, barring injury.



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Leroy
Andouille








Since: 7.2.02
From: Huntington, NY

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#37 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.15
The Onion weighs in...

Destruction Of National Pastime Given Two-Minute Standing Ovation


    A sellout crowd rose to its feet and exploded into ecstatic cheers Tuesday night as Barry Bonds completed the downfall of America's most revered sport by hitting a thundering 435-foot shot into the left field bleachers for career home run No. 756 and tainting baseball's most beloved record.

    Celebrations broke out throughout AT&T Park and thousands of flashbulbs went off as Bonds took his ceremonial trip around the bases, his arms raised in a jubilant gesture of triumph as he completed his desecration of baseball. Fireworks filled the night sky to mark the utter destruction of the national pastime, a scramble for the infamous baseball broke out in the stands, and the game was interrupted for 10 minutes in the bottom of the fifth to mark the shameful occasion.

    ...

    "Throughout the past century, the home run has held a special place in baseball and I have been privileged to hold this record for 33 of those years," said Aaron, whose legacy of persevering with profound personal dignity through racism and persecution to become the all-time home run leader will hopefully not be tarnished by public acknowledgment of Bonds.

    "I move over now and offer my best wishes to Barry and his family on this historic achievement," Aaron concluded, displaying infinitely more grace than Bonds, baseball fans, and perhaps even baseball itself had any right to ask of him.


I didn't include the last line of the article, which is my personal favorite part.




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Since: 20.6.02
From: I am the Tag Team Champions!

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#38 Posted on | Instant Rating: 4.64
I feel a little bad for Matt Murphy, the lucky bastard that caught the ball. He may have to sell the ball, whether he wants to or not. Because even if he keeps it, he'll likely still be forced to pay taxes!


    Even if he does not sell the ball, Murphy would still owe the taxes based on a reasonable estimate of its value, according to John Barrie, a tax lawyer with Bryan Cave LLP in New York. Capital gains taxes also could be levied in the future as the ball gains value, he said.


Congratulations, kid! You nearly got trampled by a crowd of rowdy Giants fans and somehow managed to emerge with the historic home run ball! For your efforts, you get a $200,000+ bill, whether you decide to profit off the ball or not!

Does that sound messed up to anyone else? Can they legally do this? The kid's thinking about keeping the damn thing himself and not make a penny off it. Why charge him a stiff tax (not to mention FUTURE taxes if the ball's value increases) that could leave him bankrupt? Are we at that point in American history where we can't even catch FREAKIN' SOUVENIRS without getting stiffed with taxes?

(edited by It's False on 9.8.07 1449)



The Wisdom of Homsar:
AaAaAaAaAaAaA! Caramel corn for president, please!
wmatistic
Andouille








Since: 2.2.04
From: Austin, TX

Since last post: 24 days
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#39 Posted on | Instant Rating: 3.08
Yeah can't believe they'd do this, but then again I can. Hating Bonds as I do I was thinking of what I would do if I caught it. I mean you'd be dumb to pass up the money, right? But I would hate knowing who got me that money.

So my only solution would be to videotape myself destroying the ball and sell the video rights. Wouldn't be worth as much as the ball, but I'm sure some people would pay to see that. I would.

Amazingly I have managed to not see any footage of the home run and hope to cotinue that up until the day someone else breaks the record. Somehow I doubt I'll make it that long.
Bullitt
Shot in the dark








Since: 11.1.02
From: Houston

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#40 Posted on | Instant Rating: 6.33
    Originally posted by wmatistic
    Hating Bonds as I do I was thinking of what I would do if I caught it.


Hating Bonds as much as you do, you wouldn't have been caught within 20 miles of AT&T Park Tuesday night, so what you would have done with the ball is irrelevant.
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My problem is, I just don't fully believe him. It seems like everytime we get an A-Rod story there is always more to it down the road.
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